[00:00.000 --> 00:07.000]  This is the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty News and activist updates.
[00:07.000 --> 00:09.000]  Online at thelibertybeat.com.
[00:09.000 --> 00:14.000]  I'm Brian Hagan with your Liberty Beat for Friday, January 16, 2015.
[00:14.000 --> 00:16.000]  Gold is trading at $1,262.
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[00:31.000 --> 00:34.000]  Extreme weather, from droughts lasting for weeks
[00:34.000 --> 00:37.000]  and torrential rainstorms robbing the country of vital crops for food
[00:37.000 --> 00:40.000]  to snowstorms of 70 inches plus,
[00:40.000 --> 00:42.000]  stopping cities in their tracks.
[00:42.000 --> 00:45.000]  Supporting your family through these difficult times
[00:45.000 --> 00:47.000]  is what eFoodsDirect does.
[00:47.000 --> 00:51.000]  Go to eFoodsDirect.com slash Liberty Beat
[00:51.000 --> 00:58.000]  or call 800-620-5520 to learn more about food security in a time of crisis.
[00:58.000 --> 01:01.000]  In the news, the location is New York,
[01:01.000 --> 01:04.000]  where it was revealed during day three of the Silk Road Trial
[01:04.000 --> 01:07.000]  that Department of Homeland Security agent Jared Duryevian,
[01:07.000 --> 01:10.000]  at one point in his involvement in the Silk Road investigation,
[01:10.000 --> 01:13.000]  suspected disgraced Mt. Gox CEO Mark Karbales
[01:13.000 --> 01:18.000]  and his right-hand man, Ashley Barr, of being the masterminds behind Silk Road.
[01:18.000 --> 01:21.000]  His suspicions led to his signing of an affidavit
[01:21.000 --> 01:25.000]  stating that he had probable cause to get a warrant to search Karbales' emails.
[01:25.000 --> 01:30.000]  Duryevian also expressed frustration with a parallel Baltimore-Maryland investigation
[01:30.000 --> 01:35.000]  that seized money from Karbales associated with alleged illegal money transfer business,
[01:35.000 --> 01:39.000]  tipping him off to the fact that there was a government investigation underway.
[01:39.000 --> 01:43.000]  It was also revealed that Karbales' attorney told Maryland investigators
[01:43.000 --> 01:47.000]  he wanted to make a deal that he would say who he thought was behind Silk Road
[01:47.000 --> 01:49.000]  in exchange for immunity.
[01:49.000 --> 01:55.000]  Karbales, in a statement to Motherboard, denied any involvement with the Deep Web website.
[01:58.000 --> 02:01.000]  A federal study released by the National Academy of Sciences
[02:01.000 --> 02:04.000]  has concluded that there is no effective alternative to the government's practice
[02:04.000 --> 02:07.000]  of mass data collection of digital communications.
[02:07.000 --> 02:10.000]  The report said no software-based technique can fully replace
[02:10.000 --> 02:13.000]  the bulk collection of signals intelligence.
[02:13.000 --> 02:16.000]  The authors called for limits on how the data is viewed and used,
[02:16.000 --> 02:19.000]  but not in limiting how much information is collected.
[02:19.000 --> 02:22.000]  The committee behind the report said stopping or slowing data collection
[02:22.000 --> 02:25.000]  will deprive analysts of necessary information.
[02:25.000 --> 02:31.000]  Countering the report, the ACLU said supporting continued bulk data collection would be a mistake.
[02:31.000 --> 02:36.000]  Today's broadcast of The Liberty Beat is brought to you by WatchMyBit.com,
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[02:49.000 --> 02:54.000]  This is The Liberty Beat for Friday, January 16, 2015.
[02:54.000 --> 03:16.000]  Check out the website at TheLibertyBeat.com.
[03:16.000 --> 03:34.000]  Okay, we are back.
[03:34.000 --> 03:37.000]  Randy Kelton, Steve Kidmore, Wheelbar Radio,
[03:37.000 --> 03:42.000]  and we're talking to Ms. Leslie in Pennsylvania.
[03:42.000 --> 03:49.000]  Okay, so you filed a rescission letter, and what did the bank do?
[03:49.000 --> 03:51.000]  Nothing.
[03:51.000 --> 03:53.000]  So they just essentially ignored it.
[03:53.000 --> 04:01.000]  So now you can go back and say that they waived any objection to rescission,
[04:01.000 --> 04:09.000]  and then because they didn't rescind, you were subjected to this improper foreclosure.
[04:09.000 --> 04:18.000]  So they're attempting to foreclose on a non-existing note.
[04:18.000 --> 04:19.000]  No, they're not.
[04:19.000 --> 04:22.000]  I'm filing for quiet title.
[04:22.000 --> 04:23.000]  Oh, okay.
[04:23.000 --> 04:26.000]  Okay, so they weren't foreclosing on you.
[04:26.000 --> 04:27.000]  No.
[04:27.000 --> 04:31.000]  That's too bad, because then you could have went for damages.
[04:31.000 --> 04:33.000]  Oh, yeah.
[04:33.000 --> 04:41.000]  But you may anyway, because since they didn't act the way they were required to,
[04:41.000 --> 04:45.000]  you were forced to file this quiet title action.
[04:45.000 --> 04:51.000]  Well, no, I can't do that either, because they are incapable of performing.
[04:51.000 --> 04:54.000]  That's part of my argument in my quiet title.
[04:54.000 --> 05:04.000]  There's nobody that's recorded that has the capacity to give me a satisfaction of mortgage.
[05:04.000 --> 05:08.000]  But there's someone who's received funds.
[05:08.000 --> 05:15.000]  Yes, but they're not capable of giving me a genuine satisfaction of mortgage.
[05:15.000 --> 05:21.000]  But they are capable of disgorging all of the funds they've collected from you.
[05:21.000 --> 05:24.000]  Exactly, see, because there's nobody in Pennsylvania.
[05:24.000 --> 05:27.000]  Remember when I was telling you that in Pennsylvania,
[05:27.000 --> 05:33.000]  you're required to file every time there's a change in the ownership of a note?
[05:33.000 --> 05:36.000]  Yes, the beneficial interest, yes.
[05:36.000 --> 05:41.000]  And that has to be recorded in two places.
[05:41.000 --> 05:44.000]  They have to have an assignment of mortgage recorded.
[05:44.000 --> 05:50.000]  But they also, which was not adjudicated in the federal court with Ms. Backer,
[05:50.000 --> 05:55.000]  but it is in the law that they have to have recorded under 625,
[05:55.000 --> 06:01.000]  a certification of the beneficial interest to correct address the residence,
[06:01.000 --> 06:04.000]  the derivative residence they call it.
[06:04.000 --> 06:06.000]  And that has to be filed.
[06:06.000 --> 06:08.000]  Wait a minute, I'm not sure I understand what that is.
[06:08.000 --> 06:12.000]  Would you explain a little better, the more what it is?
[06:12.000 --> 06:21.000]  Yeah, under 21 of the Pennsylvania statutes, number 625,
[06:21.000 --> 06:28.000]  there's a requirement that the beneficial party in interest of a mortgage
[06:28.000 --> 06:33.000]  must have their address certified.
[06:33.000 --> 06:38.000]  Now, they can have their agent sign that that's their certified address,
[06:38.000 --> 06:44.000]  but it must be certified and that must be recorded every time there's a change.
[06:44.000 --> 06:51.000]  So in Pennsylvania, they want to be sure you can find the alleged holder.
[06:51.000 --> 06:54.000]  Well, you have the money to, yes.
[06:54.000 --> 06:57.000]  Because they didn't do that.
[06:57.000 --> 07:00.000]  I've got a mortgage.
[07:00.000 --> 07:07.000]  Now, this is the one, aren't you pursuing a default judgment on these folks?
[07:07.000 --> 07:11.000]  I got a default judgment at first, and then they opened it up.
[07:11.000 --> 07:14.000]  Now I'm in the Court of Appeals.
[07:14.000 --> 07:17.000]  Because, of course, they just threw it.
[07:17.000 --> 07:19.000]  I sent you the...
[07:19.000 --> 07:21.000]  Okay, well, that's not uncommon.
[07:21.000 --> 07:25.000]  Seventy percent of all default judgments are overturned.
[07:25.000 --> 07:31.000]  The courts really don't like default judgments, but if you've got it,
[07:31.000 --> 07:34.000]  then the real place where the action is is the Court of Appeals.
[07:34.000 --> 07:39.000]  So how long has it been before the Court of Appeals?
[07:39.000 --> 07:43.000]  The brief was entered in October 30th.
[07:43.000 --> 07:45.000]  I sent you a copy.
[07:45.000 --> 07:46.000]  Oh, okay.
[07:46.000 --> 07:48.000]  So that's relatively recent.
[07:48.000 --> 07:49.000]  Yes.
[07:49.000 --> 07:52.000]  Yeah, actually, I remember that.
[07:52.000 --> 07:55.000]  You sent me finally the final copy.
[07:55.000 --> 07:58.000]  I think I've been through it a couple of times.
[07:58.000 --> 07:59.000]  Yes.
[07:59.000 --> 08:06.000]  So October, it's only four months, so how long does it take in Pennsylvania
[08:06.000 --> 08:12.000]  normally for the Court of Appeals to hear an issue?
[08:12.000 --> 08:19.000]  Well, they don't have to send in the response brief until February 2nd.
[08:19.000 --> 08:20.000]  Oh, okay.
[08:20.000 --> 08:24.000]  So this thing is still in the works.
[08:24.000 --> 08:28.000]  It's still in the works.
[08:28.000 --> 08:30.000]  It's still in the works.
[08:30.000 --> 08:31.000]  Good.
[08:31.000 --> 08:33.000]  You may win this thing yet.
[08:33.000 --> 08:35.000]  Oh, I know I will.
[08:35.000 --> 08:37.000]  I had enough stuff to win it before.
[08:37.000 --> 08:42.000]  I mean, I'm ready to throw the judge in jail.
[08:42.000 --> 08:46.000]  I mean, I've got one defendant ratting out the other one.
[08:46.000 --> 08:53.000]  They have a forged document in the records.
[08:53.000 --> 08:54.000]  Oh, wonderful.
[08:54.000 --> 08:59.000]  Did you file criminally on the document?
[08:59.000 --> 09:04.000]  Well, that's one of the things that I have set aside to do.
[09:04.000 --> 09:12.000]  I put in the complaint in the motion for interlocutory summary judgment,
[09:12.000 --> 09:16.000]  and I put it in the appeal that that is a forgery,
[09:16.000 --> 09:20.000]  that the whole purpose of MERS is to produce forged documents,
[09:20.000 --> 09:24.000]  and that this has been verified as a forgery by the other party.
[09:24.000 --> 09:27.000]  Oh, good.
[09:27.000 --> 09:32.000]  And I've got copies of all the documents in the records, in my appeal,
[09:32.000 --> 09:35.000]  with my brief and appendices.
[09:35.000 --> 09:36.000]  Okay.
[09:36.000 --> 09:42.000]  Have you heard me go through how I use the system in Pennsylvania
[09:42.000 --> 09:45.000]  because it's different than everywhere else, criminally, on the criminal side?
[09:45.000 --> 09:46.000]  Yes.
[09:46.000 --> 09:47.000]  Yes.
[09:47.000 --> 09:48.000]  Good.
[09:48.000 --> 09:56.000]  And the prosecutor said to call him as soon as I got an answer on my appeal.
[09:56.000 --> 10:02.000]  So the prosecutor is not just ignoring this issue there?
[10:02.000 --> 10:05.000]  No, no, no, no, no.
[10:05.000 --> 10:07.000]  Oh, this is wonderful.
[10:07.000 --> 10:09.000]  Oh, yeah.
[10:09.000 --> 10:16.000]  If you can get a criminal prosecution, you'll change the whole perspective.
[10:16.000 --> 10:20.000]  We have a verified forgery in the documents, in the brief.
[10:20.000 --> 10:22.000]  I bring out that it's a verified forgery,
[10:22.000 --> 10:26.000]  verified by the party who was supposed to have signed it.
[10:26.000 --> 10:30.000]  In Texas, we have Santiago v. Mackey,
[10:30.000 --> 10:35.000]  and that's where Mackey is one of the foreclosure mills.
[10:35.000 --> 10:44.000]  And Santiago Mackey, the borrower sent in a UCC 3-501 demand
[10:44.000 --> 10:46.000]  to examine the original security instrument.
[10:46.000 --> 10:49.000]  Mackey said, come on down, we've got to hear my office.
[10:49.000 --> 10:53.000]  They went down to the office, showed them a copy.
[10:53.000 --> 10:57.000]  They sued for presenting the fraudulent document.
[10:57.000 --> 11:04.000]  Mackey responded by claiming immunity while representing a client.
[11:04.000 --> 11:08.000]  The court came back and said presenting fraudulent documents
[11:08.000 --> 11:11.000]  is not a duty of a lawyer to his client.
[11:11.000 --> 11:16.000]  Mackey did an appeal, so it's a done deal.
[11:16.000 --> 11:23.000]  You may be able to get that case in Pennsylvania.
[11:23.000 --> 11:25.000]  Yes.
[11:25.000 --> 11:32.000]  Because apparently the question of the forgery is res judicata.
[11:32.000 --> 11:39.000]  The real question is, can a lawyer who filed it
[11:39.000 --> 11:44.000]  in the court claim immunity from the harm it caused you?
[11:44.000 --> 11:45.000]  Right.
[11:45.000 --> 11:48.000]  You get to sue the lawyer, the law firm itself.
[11:48.000 --> 11:51.000]  That made a big difference here.
[11:51.000 --> 11:59.000]  Because now I can go to the lawyer representing the bank and say,
[11:59.000 --> 12:03.000]  guys, the bank made a mess of the records,
[12:03.000 --> 12:07.000]  and they sent you this trash to try to foreclose on.
[12:07.000 --> 12:10.000]  You file any of those documents in any public record,
[12:10.000 --> 12:14.000]  and I will sue you personally.
[12:14.000 --> 12:18.000]  This gives us a lot of leverage.
[12:18.000 --> 12:28.000]  Maybe we'll have Ms. Leslie from Pennsylvania be whoever the law firm is.
[12:28.000 --> 12:30.000]  Ballard's Bar.
[12:30.000 --> 12:36.000]  They're the national bank association of banks.
[12:36.000 --> 12:39.000]  That is wonderful.
[12:39.000 --> 12:45.000]  If you could sue them, that's going to give them a real black eye.
[12:45.000 --> 12:46.000]  Oh, yes.
[12:46.000 --> 12:49.000]  If I might break in here for just a moment.
[12:49.000 --> 13:03.000]  In Santiago, what Mackey did was removed a state case to the federal venue for diversity.
[13:03.000 --> 13:09.000]  Then Santiago filed for leave to amend.
[13:09.000 --> 13:22.000]  They amended by adding Mackey Wolfe, Zients, and Mann as a defendant.
[13:22.000 --> 13:28.000]  Mackey Wolfe severed that issue and remanded that back to the state court,
[13:28.000 --> 13:32.000]  and that's where they had their backsides handed to them.
[13:32.000 --> 13:34.000]  Peddled.
[13:34.000 --> 13:39.000]  If you go that route, you can expect the same, Leslie.
[13:39.000 --> 13:40.000]  Oh, yes.
[13:40.000 --> 13:44.000]  They might have done better if they had left it in front of Sparks or Yeagle.
[13:44.000 --> 13:48.000]  Absolutely.
[13:48.000 --> 13:50.000]  This was in Dallas.
[13:50.000 --> 13:54.000]  It wasn't in Austin.
[13:54.000 --> 13:57.000]  It was in Dallas.
[13:57.000 --> 14:04.000]  On this Jesenowski case, they also covered one other thing.
[14:04.000 --> 14:06.000]  You've heard of Tender?
[14:06.000 --> 14:08.000]  Yes.
[14:08.000 --> 14:12.000]  It says, it is true that rescission traditionally required either rescinding
[14:12.000 --> 14:16.000]  before they return what they received before rescission could be effective,
[14:16.000 --> 14:20.000]  or that a court affirmably decree rescission.
[14:20.000 --> 14:27.000]  It is also true that the act disclaims the common law condition precedent to rescission at law
[14:27.000 --> 14:31.000]  that the borrower tendered the proceeds received under the transaction.
[14:31.000 --> 14:33.000]  Did you get that?
[14:33.000 --> 14:34.000]  Yes.
[14:34.000 --> 14:37.000]  Wait a minute.
[14:37.000 --> 14:42.000]  The only proceeds the borrower received wasn't money.
[14:42.000 --> 14:45.000]  It was a warranty deed.
[14:45.000 --> 14:51.000]  Not if it's a refinance.
[14:51.000 --> 14:52.000]  Okay.
[14:52.000 --> 15:00.000]  So in a refinance, you would have to give back to the bank all of the monies it gave you,
[15:00.000 --> 15:05.000]  and they would have to return to you all that you gave them.
[15:05.000 --> 15:14.000]  So the person doing the rescission would do a tender by set-off.
[15:14.000 --> 15:15.000]  Okay.
[15:15.000 --> 15:18.000]  Problem, problem.
[15:18.000 --> 15:22.000]  Randy, you said that she would have to return all the money,
[15:22.000 --> 15:26.000]  prove that there was a loan versus an extension of credit.
[15:26.000 --> 15:31.000]  If it's an extension of credit, there's no exchange of it in good faith.
[15:31.000 --> 15:36.000]  What you have to understand is that the lawyers that I have talked to here,
[15:36.000 --> 15:42.000]  say it's the check that you walk away from the table with you have to return,
[15:42.000 --> 15:46.000]  and they said that you have to return it when you rescind.
[15:46.000 --> 15:52.000]  What the court says here is that you do not, and the reason they don't detail,
[15:52.000 --> 16:01.000]  but the reason that the legislature put that in was because you could send your money to the bank,
[16:01.000 --> 16:05.000]  and they would put it as a prepayment on your loan.
[16:05.000 --> 16:07.000]  They wouldn't take it as settlement.
[16:07.000 --> 16:14.000]  So to stop them from doing that, they said that the bank first has to return the money,
[16:14.000 --> 16:17.000]  and the bank, all the money that you paid to date,
[16:17.000 --> 16:24.000]  and the bank first has to clear your mortgage before you have to tender,
[16:24.000 --> 16:36.000]  not the money that you got, but the present value of what you received,
[16:36.000 --> 16:41.000]  which would be, if it was a house, it would be the present value of the house.
[16:41.000 --> 16:42.000]  Okay, hang on.
[16:42.000 --> 16:45.000]  We'll pick this up when we come back on the other side.
[16:45.000 --> 16:48.000]  Present value, interesting.
[16:48.000 --> 16:51.000]  Randy Teltin, Steve Skidmore, RuRaw Radio.
[16:51.000 --> 16:55.000]  I'll call you number 512-646-1984.
[16:55.000 --> 17:03.000]  We'll be right back.
[17:03.000 --> 17:05.000]  January is the time for new beginnings,
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[19:12.000 --> 19:20.000]  Well, don't let them get to you. Only the father can't deliver you. Don't let bad-minded people hurt you.
[19:20.000 --> 19:23.000]  And just sit and get behind.
[19:23.000 --> 19:29.000]  Norman, my friend, and all of your children, come on.
[19:29.000 --> 19:45.000]  Welcome back to Rule of Law Radio, folks.
[19:45.000 --> 19:51.000]  I know I chimed in really late this evening, and Leslie, if you'll humor me for just a moment,
[19:51.000 --> 19:56.000]  I'd like to explain why I'm so late getting to the show tonight.
[19:56.000 --> 20:01.000]  The man that I work for owns a few rent properties.
[20:01.000 --> 20:08.000]  One of his tenants failed to make a payment, a couple of payments.
[20:08.000 --> 20:15.000]  Demand for payment was made with no response. Telephone calls were made with no response.
[20:15.000 --> 20:21.000]  Went online, found the guy's Facebook. He's got a picture page devoted to his dogs.
[20:21.000 --> 20:24.000]  This man loves his dogs.
[20:24.000 --> 20:34.000]  Got to the apartment, got to the duplex, and the entire place is,
[20:34.000 --> 20:40.000]  every flat surface has at least a minimum of eight inches of trash,
[20:40.000 --> 20:48.000]  which is covered completely with a crusty layer of dog feces.
[20:48.000 --> 20:51.000]  One dog was near death, had to be put down.
[20:51.000 --> 20:55.000]  The other dog may be rehabilitated.
[20:55.000 --> 21:01.000]  But I spent most of the evening speaking with police, sheriffs, deputies, and constables.
[21:01.000 --> 21:05.000]  We're trying to find this guy. We believe he may be deceased.
[21:05.000 --> 21:12.000]  So that's my excuse for making it late. If I need a hall pass, Randy, let me know.
[21:12.000 --> 21:19.000]  But I do apologize for making it late today, but it's been a rough day.
[21:19.000 --> 21:21.000]  It's been a really rough day.
[21:21.000 --> 21:30.000]  But Leslie, it sounds like you got these guys by short hairs.
[21:30.000 --> 21:37.000]  Yeah, that's about the most politically correct way we can put it.
[21:37.000 --> 21:47.000]  So with the default judgment, I'm kind of curious as to how they reopened the default judgment.
[21:47.000 --> 21:52.000]  Breaking every single rule of civil procedure.
[21:52.000 --> 22:01.000]  Okay. Have you added each and every one of these breaches of the rules of civil procedure to your complaint?
[22:01.000 --> 22:05.000]  I've added it to my brief, my appellate brief.
[22:05.000 --> 22:14.000]  Fantastic. I would venture to bet that they are not through breaking the law.
[22:14.000 --> 22:17.000]  Okay.
[22:17.000 --> 22:23.000]  I've worked several others, and I accused the judge of being in a misprision of felony.
[22:23.000 --> 22:27.000]  Oh, okay. Okay.
[22:27.000 --> 22:32.000]  You know, and I also said that failing to...
[22:32.000 --> 22:36.000]  Did you add the judge as a defendant in your case?
[22:36.000 --> 22:39.000]  No. No.
[22:39.000 --> 22:42.000]  Randy, is that possible?
[22:42.000 --> 22:46.000]  Here, you can file a judicial conduct complaint after.
[22:46.000 --> 22:47.000]  Okay.
[22:47.000 --> 22:52.000]  No, it's not possible to add the judge so long he's...
[22:52.000 --> 22:57.000]  Even if he acted improperly, so long as he was within scope.
[22:57.000 --> 23:00.000]  So you couldn't sue the judge there.
[23:00.000 --> 23:06.000]  You can file criminally against him and then pursue him there and move for disqualification or recusal.
[23:06.000 --> 23:08.000]  But no, you couldn't sue him.
[23:08.000 --> 23:09.000]  Okay.
[23:09.000 --> 23:13.000]  In the section where I question whether...
[23:13.000 --> 23:23.000]  In Pennsylvania, if you have a contract and any part of the contract prevents it from breaking the law,
[23:23.000 --> 23:27.000]  I mean, if any part of the contract, for instance, MERS and a mortgage...
[23:27.000 --> 23:30.000]  Like Covenant 16?
[23:30.000 --> 23:40.000]  Yes, but because MERS itself cannot be removed from the mortgage and the mortgage cannot be implemented
[23:40.000 --> 23:48.000]  without having a mortgagee, you can't take it out of the mortgage, you're out of the contract.
[23:48.000 --> 23:52.000]  That makes that void on its face.
[23:52.000 --> 24:00.000]  Okay. Breach of contract here in Texas and I think in several other states,
[24:00.000 --> 24:09.000]  one of the essential elements of the cause of action of breach of contract is that there be a valid contract in place.
[24:09.000 --> 24:14.000]  Be careful how you proceed on a breach of contract claim.
[24:14.000 --> 24:17.000]  You cannot...
[24:17.000 --> 24:18.000]  I'm sorry?
[24:18.000 --> 24:19.000]  Say it again?
[24:19.000 --> 24:21.000]  No breach of contract.
[24:21.000 --> 24:29.000]  Okay, so then you're making the tacit implication that there is a valid contract in place or not?
[24:29.000 --> 24:33.000]  No, I don't. I ignore that. I ignore that.
[24:33.000 --> 24:38.000]  I just say that the mortgage as written violates the law.
[24:38.000 --> 24:44.000]  Then it is not a valid contract and it's not enforceable.
[24:44.000 --> 24:45.000]  Exactly.
[24:45.000 --> 24:48.000]  That's where I was going.
[24:48.000 --> 24:58.000]  Under case law, it's very clearly in Pennsylvania that if a contract does not comply with law or causes you to breach the law
[24:58.000 --> 25:06.000]  or if any manner of administrating the law breaks the law, it's void on its face. It's void on its face.
[25:06.000 --> 25:08.000]  Then there's no...
[25:08.000 --> 25:14.000]  If the contract is invalid, then there's nothing to enforce. What are you doing in court?
[25:14.000 --> 25:18.000]  That's going to be the same in Texas. I've read that same thing in Texas.
[25:18.000 --> 25:26.000]  That if a contract violates the law or causes you to violate law, it's invalid.
[25:26.000 --> 25:33.000]  Yes. So I mean, I bring that up. I have 10 questions. I sent Randy the...
[25:33.000 --> 25:37.000]  Hang on. Let me pause you one more time. I'm sorry.
[25:37.000 --> 25:46.000]  Have you checked statute limitations on a breach of contract claim?
[25:46.000 --> 25:48.000]  I think it's four years.
[25:48.000 --> 25:53.000]  Four years? Is there a discovery rule?
[25:53.000 --> 25:55.000]  I don't know.
[25:55.000 --> 25:56.000]  Check it out.
[25:56.000 --> 25:58.000]  Like I said, I didn't...
[25:58.000 --> 26:01.000]  Wait. She's not going to breach of contract.
[26:01.000 --> 26:02.000]  Okay.
[26:02.000 --> 26:05.000]  She's going to no contract.
[26:05.000 --> 26:06.000]  Okay.
[26:06.000 --> 26:12.000]  So if the contract was void ab initio, it never ever becomes valid over the passage of time.
[26:12.000 --> 26:15.000]  Yes. So there wouldn't be a breach.
[26:15.000 --> 26:18.000]  That's what I'm claiming. It's void ab initio.
[26:18.000 --> 26:19.000]  Okay.
[26:19.000 --> 26:31.000]  And failure to adjudicate it like that means that you are admitting that they are allowed to break the rules of...
[26:31.000 --> 26:34.000]  Acquiescence is acceptance.
[26:34.000 --> 26:36.000]  Of forgery. Yeah.
[26:36.000 --> 26:42.000]  That, you know, they say it's okay to break the laws of forgery, which are...
[26:42.000 --> 26:45.000]  What do you call them?
[26:45.000 --> 26:47.000]  Felonies.
[26:47.000 --> 26:53.000]  There are several felonies involved besides the civil code, the criminal code.
[26:53.000 --> 26:57.000]  The contract itself violates the civil and criminal code in Pennsylvania.
[26:57.000 --> 27:01.000]  Smells to me like somebody's on their way to jail.
[27:01.000 --> 27:02.000]  Yeah.
[27:02.000 --> 27:06.000]  Good. Put them where they belong.
[27:06.000 --> 27:08.000]  Okay. Question.
[27:08.000 --> 27:10.000]  Yes.
[27:10.000 --> 27:16.000]  This contract, you're speaking to the security instrument, right?
[27:16.000 --> 27:18.000]  Yes.
[27:18.000 --> 27:23.000]  Is this security instrument a Fannie Mae Freddie Mac uniform instrument?
[27:23.000 --> 27:26.000]  Yes, it is.
[27:26.000 --> 27:30.000]  Oh, Mr. Leslie, you could change everything.
[27:30.000 --> 27:35.000]  Oh, I know. I know.
[27:35.000 --> 27:48.000]  But I wanted to finish out with this Hysynowski before we get lost in another Netherlands because in another month I'll be back telling you I won.
[27:48.000 --> 27:53.000]  Or that I'm going to the Supreme Court, one or the other.
[27:53.000 --> 27:55.000]  You there?
[27:55.000 --> 27:57.000]  Yes, I'm here.
[27:57.000 --> 28:09.000]  They haven't even answered... Steve, they haven't even had... they haven't answered the default.
[28:09.000 --> 28:12.000]  What was it I just said? Acquiescence is acceptance?
[28:12.000 --> 28:16.000]  No, they still have time. Will you explain that, Mrs. Leslie?
[28:16.000 --> 28:18.000]  Okay.
[28:18.000 --> 28:24.000]  They asked for 90 days to answer a brief by approving it again.
[28:24.000 --> 28:27.000]  And has the 90 days lapsed?
[28:27.000 --> 28:29.000]  No.
[28:29.000 --> 28:30.000]  Okay.
[28:30.000 --> 28:36.000]  They asked for 90 days to answer a process... oh, this is good.
[28:36.000 --> 28:39.000]  Yeah, it is.
[28:39.000 --> 28:41.000]  Like I said, it's loaded.
[28:41.000 --> 28:43.000]  That means they're scared.
[28:43.000 --> 28:46.000]  Yes.
[28:46.000 --> 28:51.000]  If they need 90 days, they need time to fabricate something.
[28:51.000 --> 28:56.000]  Did you object to the 90 days or were they granted the 90 days?
[28:56.000 --> 28:59.000]  Oh, no. They were granted the 90 days.
[28:59.000 --> 29:00.000]  Did you object?
[29:00.000 --> 29:04.000]  I didn't object. No. I had no reason to object.
[29:04.000 --> 29:10.000]  I want them to take all the time in the world because there's nothing they can do.
[29:10.000 --> 29:13.000]  Well, you're giving them time to fabricate something.
[29:13.000 --> 29:23.000]  If it were me, I would have objected to the 90 days and, Judge, give them 30. If they've got it, they should be able to dig it up within 30 days.
[29:23.000 --> 29:25.000]  And if they can't, you know...
[29:25.000 --> 29:32.000]  You have to remember, this is the Court of Appeals. They can only bring up what they brought up in the lower court.
[29:32.000 --> 29:37.000]  Uh-huh. True. No new evidence.
[29:37.000 --> 29:41.000]  Leslie, stay right there, honey. We hear the music in the background, folks.
[29:41.000 --> 29:45.000]  You're listening to Rural Law Radio, 512-646-1984.
[29:45.000 --> 29:54.000]  We'll put you in line behind Mark in Texas, who is behind Marcus in VA, who is behind Ms. Leslie in Pennsylvania.
[29:54.000 --> 29:57.000]  We'll be right back. Stay tuned.
[30:03.000 --> 30:09.000]  Marketers are getting really creative and sometimes deceitful with the labels they're putting on food packages.
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[33:25.000 --> 33:48.000]  Welcome back to Rule of Law Radio, folks.
[33:48.000 --> 33:55.000]  We've still got a line open at 512-646-1984. Jump on and fill the hole.
[33:55.000 --> 34:02.000]  Let's go back to Leslie and Leslie, I'm going to shut up and let you run, honey. Take off.
[34:02.000 --> 34:03.000]  Okay.
[34:03.000 --> 34:07.000]  Mock five with your hair on fire.
[34:07.000 --> 34:18.000]  With this Jezanowski case that just came through the Supreme Court, the bottom line is the clear import of 1635A is that a borrower
[34:18.000 --> 34:25.000]  need only provide written notice to a lender in order to exercise his right to rescind.
[34:25.000 --> 34:35.000]  To the extent 1635B alters the traditional process for unwinding such a unilaterally rescinded transaction,
[34:35.000 --> 34:40.000]  this is simply a case in which statutory law modifies common practice.
[34:40.000 --> 34:51.000]  So the Jezanowski's mailed respondents written notice of their intention to rescind within the three years of their loan consummation.
[34:51.000 --> 34:57.000]  Because this is all that a borrower must do in order to exercise his right to rescind under that act,
[34:57.000 --> 35:07.000]  the court below erred in dismissing their complaint, accordingly reversed the judgment of the Eighth Circuit and remand the case for further proceeding.
[35:07.000 --> 35:16.000]  So that's what the Supreme Court says about all that.
[35:16.000 --> 35:20.000]  So this is, okay, you didn't hear this one. This was before you got in, Steve.
[35:20.000 --> 35:23.000]  Okay.
[35:23.000 --> 35:30.000]  Will you start at the beginning for Steve's benefit, Leslie?
[35:30.000 --> 35:42.000]  Yes. The Jezanowski's filed a notice within the three years of their loan, of the consummation of their loan.
[35:42.000 --> 35:45.000]  But they waited four years and a day after.
[35:45.000 --> 35:49.000]  This is within the time period to rescind.
[35:49.000 --> 35:54.000]  Right. They filed a notice that they intended to rescind within three years,
[35:54.000 --> 36:01.000]  but they filed the court case four years and one day after the loan consummation.
[36:01.000 --> 36:08.000]  And the Eighth Circuit said that that's too late. They had to file a lawsuit within four years.
[36:08.000 --> 36:14.000]  The Supreme Court said that you don't have to file a lawsuit at all.
[36:14.000 --> 36:22.000]  It said that the only thing is a borrower exercising his right to rescind under the Act,
[36:22.000 --> 36:30.000]  only need provide written notice to his lender within three-year period, not file suit within that period.
[36:30.000 --> 36:32.000]  Done.
[36:32.000 --> 36:38.000]  A borrower shall have the right to rescind by notifying the creditor of his intention to do so.
[36:38.000 --> 36:45.000]  Leave no doubt that rescission is effected when the borrower notifies the creditor of his intention to rescind.
[36:45.000 --> 36:54.000]  This conclusion is not altered by 1635F, which states when the right to rescind must be exercised,
[36:54.000 --> 37:02.000]  but says nothing about how the right is exercised, nor does 1635G, which states that in addition to rescission,
[37:02.000 --> 37:10.000]  the court may award relief not relating to the right to rescind, support responses view that rescission is necessary,
[37:10.000 --> 37:13.000]  a consequence of judicial action.
[37:13.000 --> 37:19.000]  And the fact that the Act modified the common law condition precedent to rescission at law,
[37:19.000 --> 37:30.000]  C1635B, hardly implies that the Act thereby codified rescission in equity.
[37:30.000 --> 37:32.000]  So we are happy people.
[37:32.000 --> 37:33.000]  Okay.
[37:33.000 --> 37:34.000]  Yes, ma'am.
[37:34.000 --> 37:38.000]  I got something else I would like you to consider.
[37:38.000 --> 37:40.000]  Okay.
[37:40.000 --> 37:44.000]  All of the fees on the HUD-1 settlement statement.
[37:44.000 --> 37:46.000]  Yes.
[37:46.000 --> 37:53.000]  At closing, did the lender provide documentation to show that the fees charged on the HUD-1 settlement statement
[37:53.000 --> 37:57.000]  were not otherwise forbidden to be charged by law?
[37:57.000 --> 38:02.000]  That the services charged for were necessary?
[38:02.000 --> 38:15.000]  That the vendors who provided the services were bona fide vendors and not front companies for your fiduciaries?
[38:15.000 --> 38:24.000]  That the amounts charged were reasonable and that the lender did not take an undisclosed markup on the fees charged?
[38:24.000 --> 38:25.000]  If you didn't...
[38:25.000 --> 38:26.000]  Nope.
[38:26.000 --> 38:33.000]  Well, in that case, you have reason to believe and do believe that all of those fees were bogus.
[38:33.000 --> 38:37.000]  So if you take all of those fees and subtract them from the head of the note, run the note,
[38:37.000 --> 38:45.000]  run an amortization on the note, and see how much you would have overpaid the note over the term.
[38:45.000 --> 38:51.000]  Or wouldn't you run an AM schedule on the fees, on the aggregate fee amount?
[38:51.000 --> 38:57.000]  Well, you would take the aggregate fee amount from the HUD-1 settlement statement,
[38:57.000 --> 39:01.000]  and subtract it from the principal on the first payment.
[39:01.000 --> 39:08.000]  Yes, but if you take the aggregate fee amount sum and then run that through an AM schedule,
[39:08.000 --> 39:10.000]  that will tell you how much they screwed you out of.
[39:10.000 --> 39:15.000]  No, if you subtract it from the head of the note, this is what I did with yours.
[39:15.000 --> 39:16.000]  Yes.
[39:16.000 --> 39:22.000]  It showed that you made a $12,000 overpayment on the first payment,
[39:22.000 --> 39:28.000]  and that canceled out that $12,000 off the HUD-1 settlement statement.
[39:28.000 --> 39:29.000]  Okay.
[39:29.000 --> 39:37.000]  Then you amortize out the note with the payments that the bank required you to pay
[39:37.000 --> 39:44.000]  at payment 240 years went to zero, two-thirds of the way through.
[39:44.000 --> 39:51.000]  In fraud, you do not claim the amount you were actually defrauded of.
[39:51.000 --> 39:57.000]  You claim the amount you would have been defrauded of had the perpetrator's plan ran to fruition.
[39:57.000 --> 39:59.000]  You don't sue for that, you sue for triple.
[39:59.000 --> 40:02.000]  So here's the suggestion.
[40:02.000 --> 40:10.000]  You move for rescission, and then sue for tender by set-off.
[40:10.000 --> 40:19.000]  You sue for fraud on the false fees and claim tender by set-off against the fraud you claim.
[40:19.000 --> 40:22.000]  Does that make sense, Leslie?
[40:22.000 --> 40:26.000]  I could do that, but right now we're in the Court of Appeals,
[40:26.000 --> 40:28.000]  and this is so strong.
[40:28.000 --> 40:30.000]  You read my brief.
[40:30.000 --> 40:31.000]  Yes.
[40:31.000 --> 40:34.000]  And you'd be happy with it.
[40:34.000 --> 40:37.000]  Leslie probably doesn't need to do anything,
[40:37.000 --> 40:43.000]  and I was giving this so everybody else could hear it and get the idea.
[40:43.000 --> 40:49.000]  If your note's not over three years old and they put a bunch of fees on the front end,
[40:49.000 --> 40:52.000]  and they've been doing this forever,
[40:52.000 --> 40:56.000]  and it's not something that's been brought up so they're still doing it,
[40:56.000 --> 41:03.000]  with all the other trouble in the mortgage industry where they've cleaned up a lot of their act,
[41:03.000 --> 41:07.000]  this is not a place they've done any cleaning up,
[41:07.000 --> 41:10.000]  and they're still stealing money from everybody here.
[41:10.000 --> 41:13.000]  I've got another problem with adding fees.
[41:13.000 --> 41:23.000]  In a zero-down mortgage, the fees are rolled into the note and amortized.
[41:23.000 --> 41:30.000]  It is no longer a fee if you are paying interest on that fee.
[41:30.000 --> 41:38.000]  It can't be charged. I don't find anything in the law that allows an entity to charge interest on a fee.
[41:38.000 --> 41:41.000]  So if the fees are rolled into the note,
[41:41.000 --> 41:49.000]  and then the entire note, including the fees, is amortized, that's unjust enrichment.
[41:49.000 --> 41:54.000]  Well, the fees are financed.
[41:54.000 --> 41:59.000]  Rather than having to pay the fee, the bank agrees to finance the fee by adding it.
[41:59.000 --> 42:06.000]  I understand that. Now, okay, let's say they remove the fees from the mortgage at the initiation,
[42:06.000 --> 42:11.000]  amortize it, and then add the fees. Okay, got no problem.
[42:11.000 --> 42:15.000]  But if the fees are rolled in and then amortized,
[42:15.000 --> 42:22.000]  that forces you to pay interest on the fees which you should not be paying.
[42:22.000 --> 42:26.000]  It's no longer a fee.
[42:26.000 --> 42:29.000]  Define fee.
[42:29.000 --> 42:35.000]  A fee, okay. If I charge you a fee of $10 to enter my playground,
[42:35.000 --> 42:42.000]  I can't come to you in an hour and say, hey, you owe me an interest payment on the fee.
[42:42.000 --> 42:48.000]  I charged you $10 to enter the playground. $10, period. That's it. No interest.
[42:48.000 --> 42:58.000]  The person came to the bank and said, I don't have that fee money, so I want you to finance the fees.
[42:58.000 --> 43:02.000]  And that we can do by contract.
[43:02.000 --> 43:06.000]  Does that allow them to charge interest on the fees?
[43:06.000 --> 43:12.000]  It's not the fees. I see where you're going. They're not charging interest on the fee.
[43:12.000 --> 43:16.000]  They're charging you interest on the money that you borrowed to pay the fee.
[43:16.000 --> 43:18.000]  Yes. Okay.
[43:18.000 --> 43:29.000]  But the problem they have is certain of the amounts that are costs to the lender
[43:29.000 --> 43:34.000]  are not authorized to be charged to the borrower.
[43:34.000 --> 43:41.000]  They are considered the normal part of doing business and come out of the interest that's charged.
[43:41.000 --> 43:46.000]  Instead of taking them out of the interest that they collect, they add them to the head of the note
[43:46.000 --> 43:48.000]  and charge interest on them for 30 years.
[43:48.000 --> 43:53.000]  We're fixing to go into another break, folks, 512-646-1984.
[43:53.000 --> 43:56.000]  We'll be back after this break and wrap up with Leslie.
[43:56.000 --> 43:59.000]  Stay tuned. You're listening to Rural Law Radio.
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[46:15.000 --> 46:30.000]  Welcome back to Rule of Law Radio, folks.
[46:30.000 --> 46:37.000]  It is Friday, the 16th of January, and we're talking with Leslie in Pennsylvania.
[46:37.000 --> 46:41.000]  Leslie, we've almost got a full board of callers,
[46:41.000 --> 46:46.000]  so we need to kind of bring this to an end.
[46:46.000 --> 46:49.000]  What would you say in parting?
[46:49.000 --> 46:56.000]  Before you wrap it up, I'd like to commend you on the fight that you're putting up.
[46:56.000 --> 47:05.000]  It takes a special temper to enter into this arena, and I wholeheartedly applaud you.
[47:05.000 --> 47:14.000]  Thank you.
[47:14.000 --> 47:36.000]  Thank you.
[47:36.000 --> 47:56.000]  That's from my brief.
[47:56.000 --> 47:59.000]  I thought you were reading from your brief.
[47:59.000 --> 48:01.000]  Let me remind everyone.
[48:01.000 --> 48:02.000]  Good job.
[48:02.000 --> 48:12.000]  This is not some podunk document stuck together by some home manufacturer.
[48:12.000 --> 48:17.000]  She's addressing Fannie Mae Freddie Mac Uniform instrument here.
[48:17.000 --> 48:19.000]  This could change everything.
[48:19.000 --> 48:27.000]  And I've said in the past, whoever wrote that document had to be high on coke.
[48:27.000 --> 48:40.000]  So if you get this upheld, you essentially undermine every single mortgage in the state of Pennsylvania.
[48:40.000 --> 48:43.000]  Good luck, Ms. Leslie.
[48:43.000 --> 48:45.000]  Yes, ma'am.
[48:45.000 --> 48:50.000]  Either I win my case here at the appeals level or I take it to the Supreme Court.
[48:50.000 --> 48:52.000]  I'm going on the way.
[48:52.000 --> 48:53.000]  Wonderful.
[48:53.000 --> 48:57.000]  I would like you to do something for me.
[48:57.000 --> 49:02.000]  Give yourself a big hug and a big kiss right on the forehead.
[49:02.000 --> 49:04.000]  I'll let my husband do that.
[49:04.000 --> 49:06.000]  There you go.
[49:06.000 --> 49:09.000]  That's a safer bet.
[49:09.000 --> 49:12.000]  It looked kind of funny, you trying to kiss yourself on the forehead.
[49:12.000 --> 49:15.000]  Yeah.
[49:15.000 --> 49:17.000]  Well, congratulations, Leslie.
[49:17.000 --> 49:23.000]  Honestly, from the bottom of my heart, I wish you all the luck in the world.
[49:23.000 --> 49:24.000]  Thank you.
[49:24.000 --> 49:25.000]  She doesn't need any luck.
[49:25.000 --> 49:27.000]  She's got the code.
[49:27.000 --> 49:29.000]  Glad you said that.
[49:29.000 --> 49:32.000]  I got the lord, too, because I'm telling you.
[49:32.000 --> 49:33.000]  Good girl.
[49:33.000 --> 49:39.000]  Every time I needed something, I got a decision that would favor my case.
[49:39.000 --> 49:46.000]  When the Becker decision came out, each decision that came in her case, I needed it that week.
[49:46.000 --> 49:49.000]  I had to answer that document.
[49:49.000 --> 49:58.000]  And just like this one just came out, Jezanowski, the only argument that they can use against my brief are twofold.
[49:58.000 --> 50:03.000]  They could say I have dirty hands because I haven't paid my mortgage in four years.
[50:03.000 --> 50:04.000]  Okay?
[50:04.000 --> 50:09.000]  Or they can say I'm in foreclosure, neither of which is true.
[50:09.000 --> 50:11.000]  Or they can say I have res judicata.
[50:11.000 --> 50:20.000]  Well, res judicata is out the window because they have a forged assignment of mortgage that was created after this case was even started.
[50:20.000 --> 50:21.000]  Okay?
[50:21.000 --> 50:22.000]  Months later.
[50:22.000 --> 50:25.000]  So that's not res judicata.
[50:25.000 --> 50:36.000]  Well, if your mortgage is void ab initio, then nothing after the fact is effective.
[50:36.000 --> 50:43.000]  Well, this is the thing is we sent in letters for rescission right in the nick of time on the 34th month.
[50:43.000 --> 50:44.000]  Good for you.
[50:44.000 --> 50:50.000]  So this came in and now they can't argue it.
[50:50.000 --> 50:53.000]  It takes away their argument.
[50:53.000 --> 50:57.000]  So everything that I needed for my reply brief, I've got now.
[50:57.000 --> 50:59.000]  Good.
[50:59.000 --> 51:00.000]  Good for you.
[51:00.000 --> 51:04.000]  If you get a reply from them, get it to me.
[51:04.000 --> 51:05.000]  I definitely want to see it.
[51:05.000 --> 51:08.000]  I think I may frame them.
[51:08.000 --> 51:10.000]  You and a dozen other lawyers.
[51:10.000 --> 51:16.000]  Folks, this is what you get for paying attention.
[51:16.000 --> 51:25.000]  Because what we did, I sent this to every foreclosure defense lawyer that I could find.
[51:25.000 --> 51:27.000]  And there's a lot of them around here, but I sent one.
[51:27.000 --> 51:29.000]  I'm going to copy my brief to every one of them.
[51:29.000 --> 51:33.000]  Are they paying you consultation fees yet?
[51:33.000 --> 51:36.000]  No, not yet.
[51:36.000 --> 51:39.000]  I wouldn't hold my breath.
[51:39.000 --> 51:40.000]  OK, we need to move along.
[51:40.000 --> 51:45.000]  We got Marcus here who's been going to sue for false imprisonment.
[51:45.000 --> 51:47.000]  That sounds interesting.
[51:47.000 --> 51:51.000]  Leslie, thank you very much for calling in and keep us updated, please.
[51:51.000 --> 51:53.000]  OK, I will. Bye bye.
[51:53.000 --> 51:56.000]  Very good. Bye bye.
[51:56.000 --> 51:58.000]  Marcus in VA.
[51:58.000 --> 52:05.000]  What say you, sir?
[52:05.000 --> 52:07.000]  Doing better, I guess.
[52:07.000 --> 52:09.000]  OK.
[52:09.000 --> 52:10.000]  Yeah.
[52:10.000 --> 52:13.000]  You have the floor.
[52:13.000 --> 52:15.000]  OK.
[52:15.000 --> 52:18.000]  Did Randy get my email?
[52:18.000 --> 52:20.000]  Does he know what this is about?
[52:20.000 --> 52:23.000]  No, bring everybody up to speed.
[52:23.000 --> 52:25.000]  Quickly.
[52:25.000 --> 52:28.000]  OK.
[52:28.000 --> 52:34.000]  Back in the mid-October, my wife was summoned on a homeschooling case.
[52:34.000 --> 52:39.000]  That worked out fine, but in the process of summoning her,
[52:39.000 --> 52:44.000]  they told her that if they caught me driving her car,
[52:44.000 --> 52:50.000]  that they were going to put me in jail and take her car.
[52:50.000 --> 52:57.000]  OK, so the case was finished on January 8th.
[52:57.000 --> 52:59.000]  And I set up for it.
[52:59.000 --> 53:02.000]  Hey, Marcus, let me pause you right there.
[53:02.000 --> 53:07.000]  I hear a lot of voices in the background that are almost at the same level of yours.
[53:07.000 --> 53:13.000]  Can you get to a place where it's more private?
[53:13.000 --> 53:23.000]  OK, I'm going to try to do that.
[53:23.000 --> 53:26.000]  All right.
[53:26.000 --> 53:28.000]  I'm going to rest right here.
[53:28.000 --> 53:29.000]  Oh, OK.
[53:29.000 --> 53:30.000]  OK.
[53:30.000 --> 53:33.000]  Well, speak up and do the best you can.
[53:33.000 --> 53:35.000]  OK.
[53:35.000 --> 53:39.000]  Well, on January 8th, I showed up for the trial.
[53:39.000 --> 53:44.000]  It was dismissed, but they decided to go ahead and arrest me,
[53:44.000 --> 53:46.000]  hold me in jail overnight.
[53:46.000 --> 53:51.000]  But prior to that, I was kind of expecting it.
[53:51.000 --> 53:56.000]  I didn't want them to take my wife's car.
[53:56.000 --> 54:12.000]  Anyway, I decided to mail a number of Commonwealth attorneys some exculpatory evidence.
[54:12.000 --> 54:13.000]  Hold on a second.
[54:13.000 --> 54:22.000]  I'm going to have to get the copy here.
[54:22.000 --> 54:27.000]  OK.
[54:27.000 --> 54:31.000]  I'm going back in the corner here so that there won't be any noise.
[54:31.000 --> 54:34.000]  OK, cool.
[54:34.000 --> 54:39.000]  But see, you cover the issue of the traffic cases being commercial,
[54:39.000 --> 54:46.000]  but I can't get past the first statute in the Virginia Code.
[54:46.000 --> 54:50.000]  What does the first statute in Virginia Code say?
[54:50.000 --> 54:56.000]  That flexibility of title to vehicles on certain toll roads and parking facility.
[54:56.000 --> 54:59.000]  What is a vehicle?
[54:59.000 --> 55:00.000]  What's that?
[55:00.000 --> 55:05.000]  What is a vehicle?
[55:05.000 --> 55:08.000]  It's a commercial term.
[55:08.000 --> 55:09.000]  Yeah, OK.
[55:09.000 --> 55:10.000]  Well, I understand.
[55:10.000 --> 55:11.000]  Wait.
[55:11.000 --> 55:16.000]  How does the Virginia Code define vehicle?
[55:16.000 --> 55:17.000]  OK, Marcus.
[55:17.000 --> 55:19.000]  Real important.
[55:19.000 --> 55:20.000]  They're not speaking English.
[55:20.000 --> 55:21.000]  They're speaking legalese.
[55:21.000 --> 55:26.000]  And when they use the term vehicle, that's a term of art.
[55:26.000 --> 55:32.000]  When you use vehicle, it almost certainly means something else.
[55:32.000 --> 55:40.000]  You have to be careful and make sure that you know what their legal definition of that term is.
[55:40.000 --> 55:51.000]  Normally, when the state uses the term vehicle, they're talking about a motorized conveyance used in commerce.
[55:51.000 --> 55:54.000]  OK, I'll put it out.
[55:54.000 --> 56:00.000]  Well, that was just the title for the statute.
[56:00.000 --> 56:03.000]  I actually read this.
[56:03.000 --> 56:18.000]  The title shall apply to any vehicle and any person operating or owning a vehicle operated in any toll facility controlled by the Department of Transportation or any political subdivision of the Commonwealth.
[56:18.000 --> 56:20.000]  OK.
[56:20.000 --> 56:24.000]  Operate is another term of art.
[56:24.000 --> 56:25.000]  Right, yeah.
[56:25.000 --> 56:33.000]  OK, the point is that I'm trying to get at is they didn't catch me on a road that has a toll booth on it.
[56:33.000 --> 56:37.000]  It's not a toll booth.
[56:37.000 --> 56:40.000]  There's no toll booth on there.
[56:40.000 --> 56:42.000]  It's not a parking facility either.
[56:42.000 --> 56:51.000]  OK, so my point is, you know, how do I bring this up?
[56:51.000 --> 56:55.000]  It's not a toll booth.
[56:55.000 --> 57:06.000]  As far as I know, this only applies to vehicles and persons who are operating the vehicle on a toll road.
[57:06.000 --> 57:07.000]  I mean, that's the way I read it.
[57:07.000 --> 57:11.000]  I can't get past that.
[57:11.000 --> 57:12.000]  Are you still there?
[57:12.000 --> 57:15.000]  That is an interesting point.
[57:15.000 --> 57:19.000]  What do you mean you can't get past that?
[57:19.000 --> 57:21.000]  Well, I mean...
[57:21.000 --> 57:26.000]  He's saying that the code says it only applies to toll roads and...
[57:26.000 --> 57:27.000]  Yeah, I understand that.
[57:27.000 --> 57:35.000]  But what I'm not understanding is when you say you can't get past that, do you mean in your arguments?
[57:35.000 --> 57:39.000]  Do you mean in your interpretation?
[57:39.000 --> 57:49.000]  I tried to bring this up with a lawyer one time on a previous traffic case, and he basically dodged the whole issue.
[57:49.000 --> 57:58.000]  Also, I brought it up with another lawyer online, and he basically accused me of trying to get out of it.
[57:58.000 --> 58:01.000]  OK.
[58:01.000 --> 58:04.000]  Randy, this is going to be more your area.
[58:04.000 --> 58:08.000]  Yeah, I would confess to trying to get out of it.
[58:08.000 --> 58:12.000]  That's why I call lawyers morons.
[58:12.000 --> 58:15.000]  Exactly.
[58:15.000 --> 58:16.000]  Hang on.
[58:16.000 --> 58:18.000]  We're about to go to break.
[58:18.000 --> 58:22.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Steve Skidmore of Little Law Radio.
[58:22.000 --> 58:25.000]  I call in number 512-646-1984.
[58:25.000 --> 58:27.000]  Give us a call.
[58:27.000 --> 58:30.000]  And remember, we have a fun drive going.
[58:30.000 --> 58:42.000]  So during the break, go look at our sponsors and buy Eddie's traffic course and get some tickets in for the gun drawing.
[58:42.000 --> 58:44.000]  We need all the support we can get right now.
[58:44.000 --> 59:00.000]  We'll be right back.
[59:14.000 --> 59:41.000]  We'll be right back.
[59:41.000 --> 59:52.000]  888-551-0102 or visit us online at bfa.org.
[59:52.000 --> 01:00:03.000]  You're listening to the Logos Radio Network at logosradionetwork.com.
[01:00:03.000 --> 01:00:09.000]  This is the Liberty Beat, your daily source for Liberty News and activist updates, online at thelibertybeat.com.
[01:00:09.000 --> 01:00:14.000]  I'm Brian Hagan with your Liberty Beat for Friday, January 16, 2015.
[01:00:14.000 --> 01:00:22.000]  Gold is trading at $1,262, silver at $17.05, and bitcoin is trading around $216.58.
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[01:00:31.000 --> 01:00:37.000]  Extreme weather, from droughts lasting for weeks and torrential rainstorms robbing the country of vital crops for food,
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[01:00:58.000 --> 01:01:04.000]  In the news, the location is New York, where it was revealed during day three of the Silk Road Trial
[01:01:04.000 --> 01:01:10.000]  that Department of Homeland Security agent Jared Duryeagyan, at one point in his involvement in the Silk Road investigation,
[01:01:10.000 --> 01:01:18.000]  suspected disgraced Mt. Gox CEO Mark Karvelis and his right-hand man, Ashley Barr, of being the masterminds behind Silk Road.
[01:01:18.000 --> 01:01:25.000]  His suspicions led to his signing of an affidavit stating that he had probable cause to get a warrant to search Karvelis' emails.
[01:01:25.000 --> 01:01:32.000]  Duryeagyan also expressed frustration with a parallel Baltimore, Maryland investigation that seized money from Karvelis,
[01:01:32.000 --> 01:01:39.000]  associated with alleged illegal money transfer business, tipping him off to the fact that there was a government investigation underway.
[01:01:39.000 --> 01:01:44.000]  It was also revealed that Karvelis' attorney told Maryland investigators he wanted to make a deal
[01:01:44.000 --> 01:01:49.000]  that he would say who he thought was behind Silk Road in exchange for immunity.
[01:01:49.000 --> 01:01:58.000]  Karvelis, in a statement to Motherboard, denied any involvement with the Deep Web website.
[01:01:58.000 --> 01:02:03.000]  A federal study released by the National Academy of Sciences has concluded that there is no effective alternative
[01:02:03.000 --> 01:02:07.000]  to the government's practice of mass data collection of digital communications.
[01:02:07.000 --> 01:02:13.000]  The report said no software-based technique can fully replace the bulk collection of signals intelligence.
[01:02:13.000 --> 01:02:19.000]  The authors call for limits on how the data is viewed and used, but not in limiting how much information is collected.
[01:02:19.000 --> 01:02:25.000]  The committee behind the report said stopping or slowing data collection will deprive analysts of necessary information.
[01:02:25.000 --> 01:02:31.000]  Countering the report, the ACLU said supporting continued bulk data collection would be a mistake.
[01:02:31.000 --> 01:02:39.000]  Today's broadcast of The Liberty Beat is brought to you by WatchMyBit.com, the first ever micropayment-based video service.
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[01:02:49.000 --> 01:02:54.000]  This is The Liberty Beat for Friday, January 16, 2015.
[01:02:54.000 --> 01:02:58.000]  Check out the website at thelibertybeat.com.
[01:03:24.000 --> 01:03:46.000]  Okay, we are back. Randy Kelton, Steve Skidmore, we've got radio, we're talking to Marcus in Virginia.
[01:03:46.000 --> 01:03:53.000]  Marcus, you're in a restaurant, why don't you just stand up and tell all those people to shut up and be quiet
[01:03:53.000 --> 01:03:55.000]  or you'll whoop every one of them.
[01:03:55.000 --> 01:04:00.000]  Because you're on the radio with Randy Kelton and Steve Skidmore.
[01:04:00.000 --> 01:04:05.000]  And we want to listen while, go ahead.
[01:04:05.000 --> 01:04:09.000]  Be sure you duck after you say that.
[01:04:09.000 --> 01:04:15.000]  We have a Marcus here in Texas and he was pulled over by the police while he was talking to us.
[01:04:15.000 --> 01:04:19.000]  We tried to get him beaten into unconsciousness.
[01:04:19.000 --> 01:04:22.000]  We got close.
[01:04:22.000 --> 01:04:26.000]  Okay, Virginia Code for Vehicle.
[01:04:26.000 --> 01:04:41.000]  Vehicle means every device in or on by which any person or property is or may be transported or drawn up on a highway,
[01:04:41.000 --> 01:04:50.000]  except devices is moved by human power or used exclusively on stationary rails or tracks.
[01:04:50.000 --> 01:04:58.000]  Okay, so the old pump car on the railroad tracks, is that what they're talking about?
[01:04:58.000 --> 01:05:01.000]  That was by human power.
[01:05:01.000 --> 01:05:03.000]  Yeah.
[01:05:03.000 --> 01:05:06.000]  But it's on a fixed rail.
[01:05:06.000 --> 01:05:10.000]  They're talking about trains and trolley cars and such.
[01:05:10.000 --> 01:05:17.000]  But this one says transported and transported tends to be the commercial term.
[01:05:17.000 --> 01:05:18.000]  Yes.
[01:05:18.000 --> 01:05:23.000]  Or drawn and drawn would not be the commercial term.
[01:05:23.000 --> 01:05:36.000]  So while the commercial purpose of the vehicle is not evident from the definition,
[01:05:36.000 --> 01:05:47.000]  the fact of transportation is still a necessary element by virtue of constitution in that you have rights
[01:05:47.000 --> 01:05:53.000]  and rights may not be licensed.
[01:05:53.000 --> 01:06:01.000]  The rights cannot, constitutionally rights can never be turned into a privilege.
[01:06:01.000 --> 01:06:03.000]  It's either one or the other.
[01:06:03.000 --> 01:06:05.000]  You have a right or you have a privilege.
[01:06:05.000 --> 01:06:10.000]  The reason being a right cannot be revoked as where a privilege can.
[01:06:10.000 --> 01:06:12.000]  You have a right to travel.
[01:06:12.000 --> 01:06:15.000]  And a privilege to drive.
[01:06:15.000 --> 01:06:23.000]  And a privilege, you have a right to use the public highways for travel.
[01:06:23.000 --> 01:06:31.000]  But you do not have a right to use the public highways to generate income.
[01:06:31.000 --> 01:06:39.000]  That you achieve the privilege of doing it by license.
[01:06:39.000 --> 01:06:44.000]  But even if it's the definition in Texas, it's right in the definitions.
[01:06:44.000 --> 01:06:49.000]  Here it's not in the definition, but you still claim it as a matter of right.
[01:06:49.000 --> 01:06:51.000]  Okay, where were we with your issue?
[01:06:51.000 --> 01:06:55.000]  You were arrested and?
[01:06:55.000 --> 01:06:57.000]  The car was impounded.
[01:06:57.000 --> 01:07:05.000]  Yeah, and what did you, what was the outcome of that?
[01:07:05.000 --> 01:07:09.000]  Well, so far I've only been arrested and held in jail overnight.
[01:07:09.000 --> 01:07:12.000]  They haven't taken the car or anything.
[01:07:12.000 --> 01:07:13.000]  Okay.
[01:07:13.000 --> 01:07:18.000]  All right.
[01:07:18.000 --> 01:07:20.000]  We can barely hear you.
[01:07:20.000 --> 01:07:23.000]  Can you hear me here?
[01:07:23.000 --> 01:07:27.000]  Randy, mute.
[01:07:27.000 --> 01:07:29.000]  Sorry, I have noise in my background.
[01:07:29.000 --> 01:07:32.000]  It's my fault.
[01:07:32.000 --> 01:07:40.000]  Okay, well, still I want to address the issue of the applicability of the title to me.
[01:07:40.000 --> 01:07:44.000]  Do they have the authority to punish me according to this?
[01:07:44.000 --> 01:07:51.000]  Once I read this first statute, it doesn't look like it because Melosian is not a,
[01:07:51.000 --> 01:07:56.000]  it's not a toll road or a parking facility.
[01:07:56.000 --> 01:07:57.000]  All right.
[01:07:57.000 --> 01:07:59.000]  Okay, what does this first statute go to?
[01:07:59.000 --> 01:08:03.000]  Is it applicability of the code?
[01:08:03.000 --> 01:08:10.000]  Yeah, it says this title shall apply to any vehicle and any person operating.
[01:08:10.000 --> 01:08:11.000]  Define person.
[01:08:11.000 --> 01:08:13.000]  All right.
[01:08:13.000 --> 01:08:20.000]  Okay, well, this first statute just tells you where it applies.
[01:08:20.000 --> 01:08:27.000]  Does it apply on roads when you're driving or operating a vehicle on a road
[01:08:27.000 --> 01:08:29.000]  that does not have a toll booth on it?
[01:08:29.000 --> 01:08:33.000]  I have never seen a toll booth on a Melosian dirt bike.
[01:08:33.000 --> 01:08:42.000]  And it would seem that if they stipulated that this applies in these places,
[01:08:42.000 --> 01:08:49.000]  then it would not apply in other places not stipulated in the list of places.
[01:08:49.000 --> 01:08:51.000]  Not defined, yeah.
[01:08:51.000 --> 01:08:56.000]  What's the Eddie Craig's term for that?
[01:08:56.000 --> 01:09:04.000]  There's a Latin phrase for what's included and what's not included is excluded.
[01:09:04.000 --> 01:09:10.000]  Yeah, Espresso, Unius, S, Exclusio, Ulterior.
[01:09:10.000 --> 01:09:11.000]  Yes.
[01:09:11.000 --> 01:09:12.000]  There you go.
[01:09:12.000 --> 01:09:15.000]  That's just what I was about to say.
[01:09:15.000 --> 01:09:19.000]  Okay, so I agree with Marcus.
[01:09:19.000 --> 01:09:30.000]  It very clearly, if that's right at the beginning and it indicates the applicability of the code,
[01:09:30.000 --> 01:09:34.000]  it doesn't make sense that they would restrict that.
[01:09:34.000 --> 01:09:51.000]  Is this in a chapter that may only refer to tow boats or is this the general applicability of the entire transportation code?
[01:09:51.000 --> 01:09:59.000]  Well, it's 46.2-101, the first statute in the entire title.
[01:09:59.000 --> 01:10:03.000]  101, it certainly sounds like it.
[01:10:03.000 --> 01:10:04.000]  So that's a good point.
[01:10:04.000 --> 01:10:09.000]  You might go to subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:10:09.000 --> 01:10:19.000]  And one of the issues with that is if they put you in jail and the judge didn't have subject matter jurisdiction,
[01:10:19.000 --> 01:10:23.000]  is you can sue the judge directly.
[01:10:23.000 --> 01:10:25.000]  Sue the judge?
[01:10:25.000 --> 01:10:26.000]  Yes, sue the judge.
[01:10:26.000 --> 01:10:28.000]  He has no immunity.
[01:10:28.000 --> 01:10:30.000]  Okay.
[01:10:30.000 --> 01:10:35.000]  But we did this in a credit card case.
[01:10:35.000 --> 01:10:44.000]  The credit card company was required to file an affidavit with their petition and there was no affidavit.
[01:10:44.000 --> 01:10:51.000]  So the judge came into court and the guy was helping, stood up and said, Your Honor, what are you doing here?
[01:10:51.000 --> 01:10:52.000]  You can't be here.
[01:10:52.000 --> 01:10:55.000]  I sued you.
[01:10:55.000 --> 01:11:00.000]  It was Judge Evans. He got real excited about that.
[01:11:00.000 --> 01:11:05.000]  He got the suit and read it and he's saying, oh my, oh my.
[01:11:05.000 --> 01:11:12.000]  And then he said, Mr. Edelman, it's not my place to determine jurisdiction.
[01:11:12.000 --> 01:11:14.000]  You're required to do that.
[01:11:14.000 --> 01:11:17.000]  And he took instruction well.
[01:11:17.000 --> 01:11:20.000]  He said, with all due respect, Your Honor,
[01:11:20.000 --> 01:11:28.000]  before you send out this summons telling me all the bad stuff you're going to do to me if I don't come to your court,
[01:11:28.000 --> 01:11:32.000]  you need to make sure you have authority to do that.
[01:11:32.000 --> 01:11:35.000]  And he just kept reading it.
[01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:38.000]  The documents said, oh my, oh my.
[01:11:38.000 --> 01:11:42.000]  We accused him of impersonating a public official.
[01:11:42.000 --> 01:11:47.000]  And then he got the county attorney to write his answer.
[01:11:47.000 --> 01:11:53.000]  So he sued the county attorney for misappropriation of public funds.
[01:11:53.000 --> 01:11:57.000]  We sued the judge in his personal capacity, not in his official.
[01:11:57.000 --> 01:11:58.000]  In public, yeah.
[01:11:58.000 --> 01:12:03.000]  That was so much fun.
[01:12:03.000 --> 01:12:04.000]  So you might look at that.
[01:12:04.000 --> 01:12:15.000]  If you sued the judge, is this a municipal judge or a justice, justice of the peace?
[01:12:15.000 --> 01:12:19.000]  General, district court.
[01:12:19.000 --> 01:12:20.000]  Oh, district court.
[01:12:20.000 --> 01:12:21.000]  Oh, that's good.
[01:12:21.000 --> 01:12:28.000]  Because almost certainly, he will almost certainly have a prosecuting attorney defend him and write his lawsuit.
[01:12:28.000 --> 01:12:34.000]  Then you sue the prosecuting attorney.
[01:12:34.000 --> 01:12:39.000]  This will be so much fun.
[01:12:39.000 --> 01:12:42.000]  Well, I wanted to set up the prosecutor.
[01:12:42.000 --> 01:12:51.000]  I mean, I already sent him a document I call exculpatory evidence for all traffic cases.
[01:12:51.000 --> 01:13:00.000]  This is, you know, I explained to him the code there and the maximum of the law that we just mentioned.
[01:13:00.000 --> 01:13:10.000]  And, you know, I told him, hey, I don't, I claim the right not to be identified as a person to whom the Virginia Code 46.2
[01:13:10.000 --> 01:13:17.000]  may apply according to the Virginia Code 46.2-101.
[01:13:17.000 --> 01:13:20.000]  So I already put him on notice about this.
[01:13:20.000 --> 01:13:21.000]  Well, good.
[01:13:21.000 --> 01:13:23.000]  Sue the judge then.
[01:13:23.000 --> 01:13:26.000]  Oh, that would be great fun.
[01:13:26.000 --> 01:13:28.000]  And it's just a traffic ticket.
[01:13:28.000 --> 01:13:30.000]  So it's a really great place.
[01:13:30.000 --> 01:13:36.000]  And most likely, if you sue the judge, you'll never get another ticket.
[01:13:36.000 --> 01:13:38.000]  Oh, good.
[01:13:38.000 --> 01:13:40.000]  They will get the word.
[01:13:40.000 --> 01:13:42.000]  Leave this scoundrel alone.
[01:13:42.000 --> 01:13:44.000]  Okay.
[01:13:44.000 --> 01:13:46.000]  We do have some more callers.
[01:13:46.000 --> 01:13:47.000]  What is it?
[01:13:47.000 --> 01:13:50.000]  What was your question for us?
[01:13:50.000 --> 01:13:51.000]  Okay.
[01:13:51.000 --> 01:13:52.000]  That was the first question.
[01:13:52.000 --> 01:13:54.000]  Did you have another one?
[01:13:54.000 --> 01:14:07.000]  Well, since I was already held in jail for about 28 hours, I don't recall how much can you sue them for per hour?
[01:14:07.000 --> 01:14:15.000]  Do you remember the case, Steve out of Florida?
[01:14:15.000 --> 01:14:21.000]  Guy was held for 31 minutes.
[01:14:21.000 --> 01:14:22.000]  I remember.
[01:14:22.000 --> 01:14:26.000]  Yeah, I do remember the case, but it's been so long ago.
[01:14:26.000 --> 01:14:32.000]  I couldn't cite the case and I don't recall the amounts, but I know it was astronomical.
[01:14:32.000 --> 01:14:37.000]  Yeah, I think it was something like $60,000 a minute.
[01:14:37.000 --> 01:14:40.000]  What?
[01:14:40.000 --> 01:14:44.000]  Yeah, well, I mean, Marcus, it terrified you.
[01:14:44.000 --> 01:14:46.000]  It made you look old.
[01:14:46.000 --> 01:14:50.000]  You're only 23 and look what happened.
[01:14:50.000 --> 01:14:51.000]  Oh, my hair fell out.
[01:14:51.000 --> 01:14:53.000]  My belly got big.
[01:14:53.000 --> 01:14:54.000]  I lost my hearing.
[01:14:54.000 --> 01:14:56.000]  Oh, it was horrible.
[01:14:56.000 --> 01:15:03.000]  Was there anybody in the jail that you considered threatening to you?
[01:15:03.000 --> 01:15:09.000]  Well, I will tell you, though, that I really do have a problem with the...
[01:15:09.000 --> 01:15:15.000]  I have to have a certain amount of salt in my diet.
[01:15:15.000 --> 01:15:18.000]  You have to have what?
[01:15:18.000 --> 01:15:24.000]  I got a certain medical condition where my blood pressure will drop in the morning.
[01:15:24.000 --> 01:15:26.000]  Oh, dear.
[01:15:26.000 --> 01:15:35.000]  And I take it you didn't get your medication in the time that you were incarcerated.
[01:15:35.000 --> 01:15:37.000]  Did they put your life in jeopardy?
[01:15:37.000 --> 01:15:41.000]  They certainly did.
[01:15:41.000 --> 01:15:44.000]  Uh-huh.
[01:15:44.000 --> 01:15:53.000]  I hope you're taking notes on a napkin or something.
[01:15:53.000 --> 01:15:54.000]  That's okay.
[01:15:54.000 --> 01:15:56.000]  This is archived.
[01:15:56.000 --> 01:15:58.000]  Yeah, they placed your...
[01:15:58.000 --> 01:16:03.000]  I would think that they placed your life in danger if your life...
[01:16:03.000 --> 01:16:07.000]  Blood pressure problems are a serious issue.
[01:16:07.000 --> 01:16:13.000]  And if you don't maintain this issue, you run the risk of death.
[01:16:13.000 --> 01:16:22.000]  So they put your life directly in danger over a false charge.
[01:16:22.000 --> 01:16:24.000]  Right.
[01:16:24.000 --> 01:16:26.000]  Ouch.
[01:16:26.000 --> 01:16:30.000]  See how you get to 60 grand a minute?
[01:16:30.000 --> 01:16:35.000]  Uh, I wasn't expecting that much, buddy.
[01:16:35.000 --> 01:16:38.000]  Hey, nothing ventured, nothing gained, brother.
[01:16:38.000 --> 01:16:41.000]  Right.
[01:16:41.000 --> 01:16:44.000]  You got anything else for us?
[01:16:44.000 --> 01:16:47.000]  Um, that's pretty much it.
[01:16:47.000 --> 01:16:49.000]  Okay, okay, we're about to go to break.
[01:16:49.000 --> 01:16:51.000]  Yes.
[01:16:51.000 --> 01:16:53.000]  Mark will pick you up on the other side.
[01:16:53.000 --> 01:16:56.000]  Randy Kelton, Steve Skigmore, Wheelblower Radio.
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[01:19:13.000 --> 01:19:36.000]  Oh come on
[01:19:36.000 --> 01:19:41.000]  I can't get everything I want
[01:19:41.000 --> 01:19:43.000]  Welcome back to Rule Law Radio, folks.
[01:19:43.000 --> 01:19:48.000]  Let's go right back to Robert in the, I'm sorry, Marcus in VA.
[01:19:48.000 --> 01:19:57.000]  Real quick, Marcus, I'd like to wrap this up by saying that you were, as Randy called it over the break,
[01:19:57.000 --> 01:20:02.000]  unceremoniously ripped from your ordinary life.
[01:20:02.000 --> 01:20:13.000]  Now, when you, when they incarcerated you, the excitement of all that probably raised your blood pressure.
[01:20:13.000 --> 01:20:23.000]  When that raised your blood pressure, you were never in more need of your medication than at that time.
[01:20:23.000 --> 01:20:31.000]  And it is throughout that time they deprived you, thus placing your life in jeopardy.
[01:20:31.000 --> 01:20:36.000]  Yeah, and this we have from authority via Nurse Ratchet.
[01:20:36.000 --> 01:20:40.000]  Yeah, my wife, my soft little wife.
[01:20:40.000 --> 01:20:45.000]  My wife used to be a nurse, so she, yeah.
[01:20:45.000 --> 01:20:57.000]  She kind of put her, threw her two cents in there over the break and made real clear sense.
[01:20:57.000 --> 01:21:04.000]  So.
[01:21:04.000 --> 01:21:13.000]  Well, if there's anything that I can recommend from this point forward, be prepared to appeal.
[01:21:13.000 --> 01:21:20.000]  Always, always, always, I don't care if it's criminal or civil, be prepared to appeal.
[01:21:20.000 --> 01:21:28.000]  Because the trial court is there only for you to make your record for appeal, period.
[01:21:28.000 --> 01:21:29.000]  That's it.
[01:21:29.000 --> 01:21:31.000]  Okay.
[01:21:31.000 --> 01:21:33.000]  Okay.
[01:21:33.000 --> 01:21:37.000]  So don't get upset when the judge rules against you out of hand.
[01:21:37.000 --> 01:21:40.000]  Just grin at him and say, next.
[01:21:40.000 --> 01:21:41.000]  Yep.
[01:21:41.000 --> 01:21:43.000]  Right.
[01:21:43.000 --> 01:21:49.000]  Well, I bet your dinner's probably cold by now.
[01:21:49.000 --> 01:21:51.000]  I just have some coffee, that's all.
[01:21:51.000 --> 01:21:53.000]  Oh, okay.
[01:21:53.000 --> 01:22:01.000]  Well, go get you another cup and keep us tuned in on what's on the ongoing case here.
[01:22:01.000 --> 01:22:03.000]  Let us know what happens.
[01:22:03.000 --> 01:22:06.000]  Well, how should I deal with my lawyer, though?
[01:22:06.000 --> 01:22:11.000]  Because I want to make it clear that I want him to pursue this.
[01:22:11.000 --> 01:22:13.000]  Is he court appointed or did you hire him?
[01:22:13.000 --> 01:22:15.000]  I don't.
[01:22:15.000 --> 01:22:18.000]  Is he court appointed or did you hire him?
[01:22:18.000 --> 01:22:20.000]  He's court appointed.
[01:22:20.000 --> 01:22:22.000]  Randy?
[01:22:22.000 --> 01:22:26.000]  Your lawyer's going to do everything he can to screw you.
[01:22:26.000 --> 01:22:31.000]  So the first time he doesn't act in your benefit, file a bar grievance against him.
[01:22:31.000 --> 01:22:37.000]  When you bar grieve him, he's going to move the court to be, he's going to ask the court to be removed from your case.
[01:22:37.000 --> 01:22:41.000]  And you tell the court, don't you dare remove him from my case.
[01:22:41.000 --> 01:22:48.000]  And then when the judge removes him from the case, then you sue the judge for interfering with the private contract.
[01:22:48.000 --> 01:22:56.000]  And the judge or the lawyer is going to say that he's not under contract to you, he's under contract to the state.
[01:22:56.000 --> 01:23:03.000]  And you will agree that he is, but you are the third party beneficiary, the intended third party beneficiary,
[01:23:03.000 --> 01:23:10.000]  so you have standing to adjudicate the contract.
[01:23:10.000 --> 01:23:12.000]  Okay.
[01:23:12.000 --> 01:23:18.000]  That's how, and every time your lawyer doesn't do something you want him to, bar grieve him.
[01:23:18.000 --> 01:23:20.000]  Bar grieve him, right.
[01:23:20.000 --> 01:23:23.000]  This will make him nuts.
[01:23:23.000 --> 01:23:25.000]  Okay.
[01:23:25.000 --> 01:23:28.000]  Okay, we do need to move along.
[01:23:28.000 --> 01:23:33.000]  I think after about the second grievance, he's going to start seeing things a little clearer.
[01:23:33.000 --> 01:23:35.000]  Right.
[01:23:35.000 --> 01:23:37.000]  Well, what about not, I mean, I think...
[01:23:37.000 --> 01:23:43.000]  Wait, Marcus, we really need to move on, we're running out of time, and I've got more callers.
[01:23:43.000 --> 01:23:45.000]  Okay.
[01:23:45.000 --> 01:23:46.000]  Thank you for calling in.
[01:23:46.000 --> 01:23:49.000]  Keep us updated.
[01:23:49.000 --> 01:23:50.000]  Okay.
[01:23:50.000 --> 01:23:52.000]  Thank you for calling.
[01:23:52.000 --> 01:23:55.000]  Mark in Texas.
[01:23:55.000 --> 01:23:58.000]  What say you, sir?
[01:23:58.000 --> 01:23:59.000]  Good evening, gents.
[01:23:59.000 --> 01:24:04.000]  I've got a couple very quick questions, and I wanted to bounce these off of you guys,
[01:24:04.000 --> 01:24:07.000]  because you've got the wisdom, and I'll do pretty much what you say.
[01:24:07.000 --> 01:24:12.000]  I have a criminal defense attorney who is certainly not an expert on full-coded defense,
[01:24:12.000 --> 01:24:17.000]  who's been giving me a little bit of advice, and I have a motion ready to go,
[01:24:17.000 --> 01:24:25.000]  because in my case, the plaintiff's attorneys, after I had sued, or after I had, forgive me,
[01:24:25.000 --> 01:24:32.000]  after I had won a motion to dismiss based on the statute of limitations being expired,
[01:24:32.000 --> 01:24:35.000]  they actually got the case reopened.
[01:24:35.000 --> 01:24:40.000]  They cited that they had three exhibits which were not actually included,
[01:24:40.000 --> 01:24:44.000]  and I'm sure they set a hearing with the judge, and he just did whatever they told him,
[01:24:44.000 --> 01:24:49.000]  but in any event, what I want to ask you is, relative to these three exhibits,
[01:24:49.000 --> 01:24:53.000]  which essentially are going to be immaterial, I'm going to win on statute anyway,
[01:24:53.000 --> 01:24:59.000]  but relative to these three exhibits, and with respect to your advice that you just gave that young man,
[01:24:59.000 --> 01:25:07.000]  and certainly that I've heard before, with respect to setting the record for appeal, et cetera,
[01:25:07.000 --> 01:25:12.000]  would it be in my best interest to just call them up and say,
[01:25:12.000 --> 01:25:15.000]  could you guys please provide me with those exhibits,
[01:25:15.000 --> 01:25:21.000]  or do you think it might be smarter if I were to maybe make a motion to compel which...
[01:25:21.000 --> 01:25:30.000]  Okay, hold on, hold on. We have a rule. Never interfere with somebody who's screwing up.
[01:25:30.000 --> 01:25:34.000]  Ah, okay. So just let them screw up.
[01:25:34.000 --> 01:25:39.000]  Yes, because at the Court of Appeals, they're going to...
[01:25:39.000 --> 01:25:49.000]  if the decision the judge made was ostensibly based on the content of those exhibits,
[01:25:49.000 --> 01:25:56.000]  the trial judge may not read them, and the appellate court judges may not read them,
[01:25:56.000 --> 01:26:04.000]  but the appellate court judge's clerk will read them, and if he can't find them,
[01:26:04.000 --> 01:26:09.000]  they're going to have a problem. So whatever you do, don't give them a heads up.
[01:26:09.000 --> 01:26:16.000]  Okay, I will not. And the only reason that he could have possibly reopened the case
[01:26:16.000 --> 01:26:22.000]  is there might be some question as to facts, and these are the facts that they claim to have presented,
[01:26:22.000 --> 01:26:27.000]  which they have not. So I'm going to get them on that.
[01:26:27.000 --> 01:26:33.000]  I want to ask you a question. It's hard to articulate, but I'm going to do my best.
[01:26:33.000 --> 01:26:36.000]  And this is something I'd spoken to you about a few weeks ago, Randy,
[01:26:36.000 --> 01:26:41.000]  relative to the subject matter, not subject matter jurisdiction,
[01:26:41.000 --> 01:26:44.000]  but the right to actually even invoke the jurisdiction of the court.
[01:26:44.000 --> 01:26:48.000]  And you'd suggest that I might need to make a plea to the jurisdiction.
[01:26:48.000 --> 01:26:51.000]  I think we're talking capacity here.
[01:26:51.000 --> 01:26:53.000]  Yes, yes, capacity.
[01:26:53.000 --> 01:27:00.000]  Yeah, exactly. In my case, because the plaintiff in their original complaint
[01:27:00.000 --> 01:27:04.000]  said the last payment made was in 2007, there's a five-year statute of limitations,
[01:27:04.000 --> 01:27:09.000]  and I filed in 2013, they filed it past the statute of limitations.
[01:27:09.000 --> 01:27:14.000]  Okay, hold on, hold on. The statute of limitation on foreclosure
[01:27:14.000 --> 01:27:22.000]  starts to run when the lender files a notice of acceleration.
[01:27:22.000 --> 01:27:24.000]  Right.
[01:27:24.000 --> 01:27:31.000]  Okay, not when you stop paying. So how long ago did they file their first notice of acceleration?
[01:27:31.000 --> 01:27:40.000]  The first one was actually filed in 2006, so it goes back even further. I have record of that.
[01:27:40.000 --> 01:27:45.000]  How was, was there some type of reinstatement?
[01:27:45.000 --> 01:27:53.000]  There was never a reinstatement per se or nothing that I recognized that. I tried to do three works.
[01:27:53.000 --> 01:28:04.000]  Well, I mean, was there something that you did in response to an agreement with the lender
[01:28:04.000 --> 01:28:08.000]  that gave the lender cause to reinstate?
[01:28:08.000 --> 01:28:10.000]  Never, no.
[01:28:10.000 --> 01:28:18.000]  Perfect, perfect. Because we have lenders sending a second or a third notice of acceleration,
[01:28:18.000 --> 01:28:26.000]  and they try to rely on that, they say the clock runs from the last acceleration,
[01:28:26.000 --> 01:28:29.000]  and the courts have said, no, it runs from the first.
[01:28:29.000 --> 01:28:34.000]  That's what they're trying to do here. They're trying to say, because I screwed this up,
[01:28:34.000 --> 01:28:39.000]  early on I said that I attempted to make payments, this is absolutely wrong, Your Honor,
[01:28:39.000 --> 01:28:47.000]  and I attempted to make payments, I tried to do a workout, I even submitted, it wasn't the smartest.
[01:28:47.000 --> 01:28:51.000]  But you attempted to make payments in 2006.
[01:28:51.000 --> 01:28:55.000]  I attempted to make payments in 2010.
[01:28:55.000 --> 01:29:01.000]  No, no, no, you're mistaken, you're getting old and your memory is failing.
[01:29:01.000 --> 01:29:08.000]  Oh, yeah, I follow what you're saying. I gave them an affidavit, this is the brilliance of it all,
[01:29:08.000 --> 01:29:14.000]  and I said the last payment, and this was at the time was what I believed, I now believe it was 2006,
[01:29:14.000 --> 01:29:19.000]  I submitted an affidavit already that said the last payment I made to the lender,
[01:29:19.000 --> 01:29:25.000]  the lender, the original party, one, two, me being one of those, was in 2007,
[01:29:25.000 --> 01:29:28.000]  which is what they were saying in their complaint.
[01:29:28.000 --> 01:29:35.000]  Turns out it actually was in 2006, and then it was supposedly transferred.
[01:29:35.000 --> 01:29:38.000]  That didn't happen in terms of the record.
[01:29:38.000 --> 01:29:41.000]  Okay, hang on, we're about to go to break.
[01:29:41.000 --> 01:29:49.000]  This is Randy Kelton, Steve Skidmore, we have our radio, our call-in number, 512-646-1984.
[01:29:49.000 --> 01:29:54.000]  We've got 30 minutes left, so we've probably got time for one more caller.
[01:29:54.000 --> 01:29:59.000]  So give us a call and make sure you go see our sponsors, we'll be right back.
[01:30:03.000 --> 01:30:06.000]  Is modern life making kids grow up too fast?
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[01:30:49.000 --> 01:30:54.000]  Childhood isn't what it used to be, and it could be affecting the mental health of our kids.
[01:30:54.000 --> 01:30:59.000]  In Britain, an epidemic of childhood depression has a prestigious group of scientists,
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[01:31:21.000 --> 01:31:26.000]  I'm Dr. Catherine Albrecht, more news and information at CatherineAlbrecht.com.
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[01:33:01.000 --> 01:33:04.000]  You are listening to the Logos Radio Network.
[01:33:04.000 --> 01:33:28.000]  logosradionetwork.com
[01:33:28.000 --> 01:33:31.000]  Welcome back to almost the Logos Radio.
[01:33:31.000 --> 01:33:35.000]  Welcome back to Rule of Law Radio on the Logos Radio Network.
[01:33:35.000 --> 01:33:39.000]  And speaking of the Logos Radio Network, Mark in Texas,
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[01:34:58.000 --> 01:35:02.000]  but let's pick up where we left off.
[01:35:02.000 --> 01:35:04.000]  Do you remember where you were?
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[01:35:09.000 --> 01:35:14.000]  More or less what I wanted to bounce off you guys and find out is,
[01:35:14.000 --> 01:35:18.000]  if you would suggest that in order to set the record straight,
[01:35:18.000 --> 01:35:22.000]  I need to make a plea to the jurisdiction,
[01:35:22.000 --> 01:35:25.000]  and this would be something appropriate,
[01:35:25.000 --> 01:35:33.000]  citing that the plaintiff did not have sufficient reason to actually invoke the jurisdiction.
[01:35:33.000 --> 01:35:37.000]  Capacity, not reason, capacity.
[01:35:37.000 --> 01:35:40.000]  Capacity to invoke the jurisdiction of court.
[01:35:40.000 --> 01:35:45.000]  Okay, here's how I frame that argument.
[01:35:45.000 --> 01:35:50.000]  I'm not saying, Your Honor, that the court does not have subject matter,
[01:35:50.000 --> 01:35:53.000]  does not have jurisdiction over the subject matter.
[01:35:53.000 --> 01:36:00.000]  For certain, the court would have jurisdiction over the subject matter
[01:36:00.000 --> 01:36:06.000]  if the movement had the capacity to invoke that jurisdiction.
[01:36:06.000 --> 01:36:07.000]  Right.
[01:36:07.000 --> 01:36:12.000]  Venue is proper, in personum, you got it.
[01:36:12.000 --> 01:36:15.000]  Subject matter, great.
[01:36:15.000 --> 01:36:18.000]  Capacity, oh, wait a minute.
[01:36:18.000 --> 01:36:26.000]  There is no matter in controversy as the cause of action has expired.
[01:36:26.000 --> 01:36:27.000]  Yes.
[01:36:27.000 --> 01:36:35.000]  Now, here in Texas, I've dug up a lot of case law off of Lexis recently
[01:36:35.000 --> 01:36:40.000]  that says the cause of action itself expires.
[01:36:40.000 --> 01:36:48.000]  Now, some of the case law will say that the limitation period on the underlying cause expired,
[01:36:48.000 --> 01:36:55.000]  but other cases, when I say cases, other opinions from the appellate court
[01:36:55.000 --> 01:36:59.000]  say that the cause of action expired.
[01:36:59.000 --> 01:37:00.000]  Well, wait a minute.
[01:37:00.000 --> 01:37:07.000]  If the cause of action expired, then there is no subject matter before the court.
[01:37:07.000 --> 01:37:08.000]  Right.
[01:37:08.000 --> 01:37:12.000]  If there is no subject matter before the court, then how,
[01:37:12.000 --> 01:37:18.000]  if you put nothing before the court, how can the court have jurisdiction over nothing?
[01:37:18.000 --> 01:37:23.000]  Yes, if it's expired, there is no longer a controversy that can be raised.
[01:37:23.000 --> 01:37:24.000]  Right.
[01:37:24.000 --> 01:37:25.000]  Follow that.
[01:37:25.000 --> 01:37:30.000]  If they did that, if I had done that on the day I got their complaint,
[01:37:30.000 --> 01:37:33.000]  I feel like that would have been perfect.
[01:37:33.000 --> 01:37:40.000]  Subject matter jurisdiction can be raised at any time, even for the first time on appeal.
[01:37:40.000 --> 01:37:41.000]  Okay.
[01:37:41.000 --> 01:37:42.000]  I got it.
[01:37:42.000 --> 01:37:43.000]  That's true.
[01:37:43.000 --> 01:37:45.000]  That's in the Arkansas statutes too.
[01:37:45.000 --> 01:37:46.000]  So that was the question.
[01:37:46.000 --> 01:37:49.000]  And then whenever I spoke to Randy a few weeks ago,
[01:37:49.000 --> 01:37:51.000]  I absolutely loved how animated you got about it.
[01:37:51.000 --> 01:37:55.000]  You told me, you said you can take your motion and use it for toilet paper.
[01:37:55.000 --> 01:37:58.000]  This is the thing that you need to do.
[01:37:58.000 --> 01:38:05.000]  And then if I remember correctly, you said, if I should make this plea to the jurisdiction
[01:38:05.000 --> 01:38:09.000]  and there's no activity, then the judge is guilty of malpractice
[01:38:09.000 --> 01:38:13.000]  and certainly they're guilty of malpractice for filing this frivolous lawsuit.
[01:38:13.000 --> 01:38:16.000]  No, no, no, no, no, no, no.
[01:38:16.000 --> 01:38:18.000]  Okay, misunderstood.
[01:38:18.000 --> 01:38:25.000]  An attorney can file a frivolous pleading so long as he does not break the law
[01:38:25.000 --> 01:38:28.000]  in the process of doing so.
[01:38:28.000 --> 01:38:29.000]  Okay.
[01:38:29.000 --> 01:38:32.000]  Frivolous pleadings are not held against an attorney.
[01:38:32.000 --> 01:38:35.000]  So don't go down that road.
[01:38:35.000 --> 01:38:36.000]  All right.
[01:38:36.000 --> 01:38:37.000]  We won't.
[01:38:37.000 --> 01:38:41.000]  It might be a griping point, but it's nothing you can hold against him.
[01:38:41.000 --> 01:38:45.000]  He is acting in the best interest of his client.
[01:38:45.000 --> 01:38:46.000]  I follow.
[01:38:46.000 --> 01:38:47.000]  Okay.
[01:38:47.000 --> 01:38:54.000]  But he may not make arguments that are collaterally stopped.
[01:38:54.000 --> 01:38:55.000]  Correct.
[01:38:55.000 --> 01:39:01.000]  He may not argue an issue that's already been adjudicated in other courts.
[01:39:01.000 --> 01:39:04.000]  He may not misargue an issue.
[01:39:04.000 --> 01:39:07.000]  All of these are grounds for sanctions.
[01:39:07.000 --> 01:39:10.000]  And sanctions really scare attorneys.
[01:39:10.000 --> 01:39:15.000]  Now for, I believe you're trying to tell me something important.
[01:39:15.000 --> 01:39:20.000]  In my case, in June, I won.
[01:39:20.000 --> 01:39:24.000]  I had an unopposed motion to dismiss their positive action
[01:39:24.000 --> 01:39:27.000]  based on the statute of limitations being pulled.
[01:39:27.000 --> 01:39:29.000]  And so should that be raised again,
[01:39:29.000 --> 01:39:34.000]  that might be something where it's collaterally stopped.
[01:39:34.000 --> 01:39:36.000]  They raised it in their motion to reopen,
[01:39:36.000 --> 01:39:40.000]  citing that I mentioned I tried to make payments.
[01:39:40.000 --> 01:39:44.000]  In 2010, I had one returned.
[01:39:44.000 --> 01:39:49.000]  And is that an issue there that might be collaterally stopped
[01:39:49.000 --> 01:39:51.000]  based on their original complaint?
[01:39:51.000 --> 01:39:55.000]  Or could it be the case that since I mentioned that in my response,
[01:39:55.000 --> 01:39:57.000]  and they didn't catch it because they weren't paying attention
[01:39:57.000 --> 01:40:01.000]  and they're the lowest bidder and maybe stupid,
[01:40:01.000 --> 01:40:07.000]  could it be that they have legitimate reason to ask them to reopen the case
[01:40:07.000 --> 01:40:09.000]  and then I have to go ahead and file a motion
[01:40:09.000 --> 01:40:12.000]  which statutory will let me win anyway?
[01:40:12.000 --> 01:40:13.000]  What do you think about that?
[01:40:13.000 --> 01:40:18.000]  That's going to go to state case law
[01:40:18.000 --> 01:40:20.000]  because it's so specific.
[01:40:20.000 --> 01:40:24.000]  If I try to make a payment,
[01:40:24.000 --> 01:40:29.000]  did that toll the statute of limitations?
[01:40:29.000 --> 01:40:31.000]  Okay. I know we have one.
[01:40:31.000 --> 01:40:33.000]  That's a real specific,
[01:40:33.000 --> 01:40:36.000]  and every state's going to have to rule on that
[01:40:36.000 --> 01:40:42.000]  because I don't know of anything in code that addresses that particular issue.
[01:40:42.000 --> 01:40:47.000]  Not making a payment, but trying to make a payment that wasn't accepted,
[01:40:47.000 --> 01:40:52.000]  I would think that trying to make a payment that wasn't accepted
[01:40:52.000 --> 01:40:56.000]  cannot be construed as making a payment.
[01:40:56.000 --> 01:41:01.000]  And what are these, Gull, you're saying that making an attempt
[01:41:01.000 --> 01:41:06.000]  to make a payment stipulates to...
[01:41:06.000 --> 01:41:08.000]  Can you stipulate to jurisdictions?
[01:41:08.000 --> 01:41:13.000]  Steve, can you weigh statute of limitations?
[01:41:13.000 --> 01:41:16.000]  I mean, if they don't have capacity...
[01:41:16.000 --> 01:41:18.000]  Yeah, you can weigh statute of limitations,
[01:41:18.000 --> 01:41:23.000]  but what cannot be waived is subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:41:23.000 --> 01:41:28.000]  And if the statute of limitations has run,
[01:41:28.000 --> 01:41:32.000]  there's no subject matter to have jurisdiction over.
[01:41:32.000 --> 01:41:34.000]  Yeah, that's exactly where I was going.
[01:41:34.000 --> 01:41:40.000]  They're saying that we didn't have subject matter jurisdiction
[01:41:40.000 --> 01:41:43.000]  because the limitations had run,
[01:41:43.000 --> 01:41:47.000]  but because he tried to make a payment after we demanded that he do
[01:41:47.000 --> 01:41:50.000]  and threatened to do bad things to him if he didn't,
[01:41:50.000 --> 01:41:56.000]  and because he did that, all of a sudden we got subject matter jurisdiction back.
[01:41:56.000 --> 01:41:57.000]  No.
[01:41:57.000 --> 01:42:00.000]  It's more like the situation where their original complaint,
[01:42:00.000 --> 01:42:03.000]  their original complaints filed as the statute of limitations...
[01:42:03.000 --> 01:42:08.000]  Oh, wait a minute, hold on, overshadowing.
[01:42:08.000 --> 01:42:11.000]  Are you familiar with overshadowing?
[01:42:11.000 --> 01:42:14.000]  No, I'm totally not.
[01:42:14.000 --> 01:42:18.000]  Okay, they were outside statute of limitations.
[01:42:18.000 --> 01:42:21.000]  Wait a minute, were they 6, 10,
[01:42:21.000 --> 01:42:23.000]  how long the statute of limitations were?
[01:42:23.000 --> 01:42:24.000]  Mississippi?
[01:42:24.000 --> 01:42:25.000]  Arkansas.
[01:42:25.000 --> 01:42:26.000]  Arkansas.
[01:42:26.000 --> 01:42:28.000]  Okay, Arkansas.
[01:42:28.000 --> 01:42:30.000]  Four-year statute?
[01:42:30.000 --> 01:42:32.000]  Five-year statute of limitations,
[01:42:32.000 --> 01:42:35.000]  and they filed six years after they claimed the last payment...
[01:42:35.000 --> 01:42:39.000]  Okay, so when they claimed that you attempted to make a payment,
[01:42:39.000 --> 01:42:44.000]  that would have been within the limitations period.
[01:42:44.000 --> 01:42:47.000]  Within that timeframe, yeah.
[01:42:47.000 --> 01:42:51.000]  That's a complex case law question.
[01:42:51.000 --> 01:42:55.000]  Yeah, and here's something else that's going to convolute it even further.
[01:42:55.000 --> 01:43:00.000]  What medium of exchange did you attempt to tender payment?
[01:43:00.000 --> 01:43:02.000]  It was via Western Union.
[01:43:02.000 --> 01:43:04.000]  Western Union.
[01:43:04.000 --> 01:43:09.000]  Did they return your Western Union document
[01:43:09.000 --> 01:43:12.000]  or did they pay you out of their own coffers?
[01:43:12.000 --> 01:43:15.000]  No, they returned the document itself.
[01:43:15.000 --> 01:43:17.000]  They returned it via Western Union.
[01:43:17.000 --> 01:43:19.000]  They just simply refused it.
[01:43:19.000 --> 01:43:22.000]  Okay, okay.
[01:43:22.000 --> 01:43:25.000]  Well, okay, here we go.
[01:43:25.000 --> 01:43:29.000]  We're coming up on a break, so I'll try to spit this out.
[01:43:29.000 --> 01:43:36.000]  If they had put your Western Union transfer in their account
[01:43:36.000 --> 01:43:41.000]  and then wrote a check on their account to repay it, then it's accepted.
[01:43:41.000 --> 01:43:46.000]  However, since they returned your instrument, they did not accept it,
[01:43:46.000 --> 01:43:49.000]  and I would argue that that did not,
[01:43:49.000 --> 01:43:51.000]  since they returned the original instrument,
[01:43:51.000 --> 01:43:54.000]  that did not toll the statute of limitations.
[01:43:54.000 --> 01:44:00.000]  Stay right there, we'll be right back.
[01:44:00.000 --> 01:44:04.000]  You feel tired when talking about important topics like money and politics?
[01:44:04.000 --> 01:44:05.000]  Sorry.
[01:44:05.000 --> 01:44:08.000]  Are you confused by words like the Constitution or the Federal Reserve?
[01:44:08.000 --> 01:44:09.000]  What?
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[01:46:01.000 --> 01:46:24.000]  Welcome back to Rule Law Radio, folks.
[01:46:24.000 --> 01:46:29.000]  We are in the last segment, and we are visiting now with Mark in Texas.
[01:46:29.000 --> 01:46:34.000]  Mark, Randy and I were kind of talking over the break as we do,
[01:46:34.000 --> 01:46:39.000]  and Randy was making paper airplanes out of a check written to the bank
[01:46:39.000 --> 01:46:42.000]  and throwing it at the door of the bank.
[01:46:42.000 --> 01:46:45.000]  And then he backed up, and then he wrote another check,
[01:46:45.000 --> 01:46:49.000]  and he went to the post office and told the postal clerk that,
[01:46:49.000 --> 01:46:52.000]  well, I've got this check I'd like to send to the bank,
[01:46:52.000 --> 01:46:55.000]  but I've kind of changed my mind.
[01:46:55.000 --> 01:47:00.000]  So the whole point of Randy's argument was,
[01:47:00.000 --> 01:47:04.000]  when does an attempt become an attempt?
[01:47:04.000 --> 01:47:09.000]  I believe that both of us agree that an attempt becomes an attempt
[01:47:09.000 --> 01:47:15.000]  when the intended payee receives.
[01:47:15.000 --> 01:47:22.000]  Now, if you sent an instrument via Western Union,
[01:47:22.000 --> 01:47:29.000]  they received it that could be determined as an attempt to pay.
[01:47:29.000 --> 01:47:35.000]  However, that instrument was returned.
[01:47:35.000 --> 01:47:37.000]  It was not entered onto their books.
[01:47:37.000 --> 01:47:41.000]  It was returned as is.
[01:47:41.000 --> 01:47:50.000]  So since they received and rejected, I don't see, had they accepted it?
[01:47:50.000 --> 01:47:54.000]  Had they put that in their coffers
[01:47:54.000 --> 01:47:59.000]  and then written you a check off their own account to repay that amount,
[01:47:59.000 --> 01:48:05.000]  then they could claim that you attempted to make a payment,
[01:48:05.000 --> 01:48:14.000]  because we show here in our records that this Western Union instrument
[01:48:14.000 --> 01:48:17.000]  was entered into our books,
[01:48:17.000 --> 01:48:24.000]  and our books also show that we wrote a check on X date and returned his funds.
[01:48:24.000 --> 01:48:30.000]  Well, you accepted it, so that may toll the statute of limitations,
[01:48:30.000 --> 01:48:34.000]  but since they returned the original instrument,
[01:48:34.000 --> 01:48:40.000]  I would stand firm by saying that that did not toll the statute of limitations.
[01:48:40.000 --> 01:48:48.000]  It did not push the pause button or extend the limitation period.
[01:48:48.000 --> 01:48:54.000]  But in the end, this is clearly a question of law.
[01:48:54.000 --> 01:48:58.000]  Absolutely, and the question of law is determined by the court.
[01:48:58.000 --> 01:49:02.000]  So you're going to have to put together a really tight argument
[01:49:02.000 --> 01:49:08.000]  if they try to say that, well, by attempting to make a payment,
[01:49:08.000 --> 01:49:12.000]  that extended the limitation period.
[01:49:12.000 --> 01:49:16.000]  Did they have case law in support of that?
[01:49:16.000 --> 01:49:20.000]  Their case law is incredibly weak,
[01:49:20.000 --> 01:49:24.000]  and I have statutes that shoots all of it down,
[01:49:24.000 --> 01:49:29.000]  because in this case, in 2010, I was making this payment to a third party,
[01:49:29.000 --> 01:49:31.000]  to the original transaction,
[01:49:31.000 --> 01:49:34.000]  and they have specific statutes in Arkansas that says,
[01:49:34.000 --> 01:49:40.000]  for the purposes of tolling the statute of limitations with respect to third parties,
[01:49:40.000 --> 01:49:43.000]  if there's a payment, if there's a written acknowledgement of debt,
[01:49:43.000 --> 01:49:50.000]  it has to be recorded on the margin in the area in which the instrument is recorded.
[01:49:50.000 --> 01:49:54.000]  They have nothing recorded. They don't record anything.
[01:49:54.000 --> 01:49:58.000]  So I'm going to win on statute, even if that did do it.
[01:49:58.000 --> 01:50:02.000]  What I'm wondering is if you gentlemen would also suggest that
[01:50:02.000 --> 01:50:06.000]  I still need to focus on doing the plea to the jurisdiction,
[01:50:06.000 --> 01:50:10.000]  or maybe even just have that language in my brief,
[01:50:10.000 --> 01:50:16.000]  which supports the motion that discusses the statute that will allow me to win anyway.
[01:50:16.000 --> 01:50:23.000]  If you have not made a plea to the jurisdiction, absolutely make one.
[01:50:23.000 --> 01:50:25.000]  Okay, I will.
[01:50:25.000 --> 01:50:33.000]  And then my question, and is that because that original complaint has gravity
[01:50:33.000 --> 01:50:39.000]  that supersedes whatever's discovered during the one-year process that I've been through?
[01:50:39.000 --> 01:50:42.000]  If I mentioned I made payments, but they didn't mention it,
[01:50:42.000 --> 01:50:46.000]  they don't have the accounting for it, they can't prove it under those circumstances,
[01:50:46.000 --> 01:50:49.000]  would you say it still might have...
[01:50:49.000 --> 01:50:57.000]  Well, actually, since the alleged attempt to pay was within the limitations period,
[01:50:57.000 --> 01:51:06.000]  if the attempt to pay told the limitation period, that would be relevant.
[01:51:06.000 --> 01:51:12.000]  But you're claiming that it doesn't, so absolutely make the claim.
[01:51:12.000 --> 01:51:16.000]  If you don't make the claim, you're sure to lose.
[01:51:16.000 --> 01:51:19.000]  I follow where you're coming from.
[01:51:19.000 --> 01:51:23.000]  It would be relevant in my case if I did it with the original lender,
[01:51:23.000 --> 01:51:29.000]  but based on the statutes for extension of maturity date and things of that sort,
[01:51:29.000 --> 01:51:34.000]  in the state of Arkansas at least, they note that if it's done with a third party,
[01:51:34.000 --> 01:51:38.000]  it doesn't hold the statute of limitations unless it's recorded.
[01:51:38.000 --> 01:51:41.000]  There's nothing recorded at all.
[01:51:41.000 --> 01:51:43.000]  Perfect.
[01:51:43.000 --> 01:51:50.000]  I found an article by an old, super smart lawyer in some firm that actually defends banks,
[01:51:50.000 --> 01:51:55.000]  and it was almost like an article that he had to warn them about it.
[01:51:55.000 --> 01:52:00.000]  I happened to find it on Google and I thought, hey, this is exactly what I need.
[01:52:00.000 --> 01:52:07.000]  Actually, all of the arguments, the statutory argument included that you have referenced so far,
[01:52:07.000 --> 01:52:13.000]  all go to subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:52:13.000 --> 01:52:16.000]  Or capacity.
[01:52:16.000 --> 01:52:20.000]  Yeah, the capacity of the plaintiff to invoke the subject matter jurisdiction.
[01:52:20.000 --> 01:52:25.000]  So everything, it appears, should revolve around that issue.
[01:52:25.000 --> 01:52:34.000]  Is it sufficient to put a plea to jurisdiction in my brief in support of this motion,
[01:52:34.000 --> 01:52:37.000]  or should I do it separately so it appears its own?
[01:52:37.000 --> 01:52:39.000]  Definitely separate document.
[01:52:39.000 --> 01:52:40.000]  Yes.
[01:52:40.000 --> 01:52:41.000]  Don't confuse the judge.
[01:52:41.000 --> 01:52:43.000]  Okay.
[01:52:43.000 --> 01:52:48.000]  That clarifies everything for me, and that was what I wanted to ask you guys last week.
[01:52:48.000 --> 01:52:53.000]  I'm sorry I wasn't very articulate, but I really do appreciate it.
[01:52:53.000 --> 01:52:54.000]  Well, good.
[01:52:54.000 --> 01:52:58.000]  And if I kind of stepped on you last week, I didn't mean to be too difficult,
[01:52:58.000 --> 01:53:06.000]  but subject matter jurisdiction issue was just too important to lose focus on it.
[01:53:06.000 --> 01:53:08.000]  Oh, I understand.
[01:53:08.000 --> 01:53:12.000]  I understood it had weight, and I thank God I had time.
[01:53:12.000 --> 01:53:15.000]  These guys are not really trying to push this.
[01:53:15.000 --> 01:53:20.000]  They haven't done anything for over 120 days, perhaps.
[01:53:20.000 --> 01:53:22.000]  So I think I've got time.
[01:53:22.000 --> 01:53:24.000]  Maybe they're just waiting to see what I'm going to do.
[01:53:24.000 --> 01:53:26.000]  That is a good sign.
[01:53:26.000 --> 01:53:28.000]  Yes.
[01:53:28.000 --> 01:53:34.000]  They're not too quick to want to get into court and get their butts kicked.
[01:53:34.000 --> 01:53:35.000]  Yeah.
[01:53:35.000 --> 01:53:36.000]  I have a feeling.
[01:53:36.000 --> 01:53:41.000]  Whenever I had my first motion, it sat on the judge's desk for over 90 days.
[01:53:41.000 --> 01:53:43.000]  They were moving the court.
[01:53:43.000 --> 01:53:46.000]  You're supposed to rule on it within 10 days, I believe.
[01:53:46.000 --> 01:53:47.000]  Okay.
[01:53:47.000 --> 01:53:54.000]  If you put a motion into the court, you have to move to get the motion put on for hearing.
[01:53:54.000 --> 01:53:56.000]  The court doesn't do that.
[01:53:56.000 --> 01:53:57.000]  Right.
[01:53:57.000 --> 01:53:58.000]  They didn't do that.
[01:53:58.000 --> 01:54:00.000]  That's what it was.
[01:54:00.000 --> 01:54:01.000]  Okay.
[01:54:01.000 --> 01:54:04.000]  You understand how that part works, do you?
[01:54:04.000 --> 01:54:05.000]  Not incredibly well.
[01:54:05.000 --> 01:54:08.000]  I believe I have to set it for hearing, perhaps.
[01:54:08.000 --> 01:54:09.000]  Yes.
[01:54:09.000 --> 01:54:10.000]  Okay.
[01:54:10.000 --> 01:54:11.000]  You file motion.
[01:54:11.000 --> 01:54:16.000]  You have the other side serve by process.
[01:54:16.000 --> 01:54:20.000]  Then you set the motion for hearing.
[01:54:20.000 --> 01:54:22.000]  That means that you call down to it.
[01:54:22.000 --> 01:54:23.000]  Hold on.
[01:54:23.000 --> 01:54:28.000]  First, you contact the other side and say, I'm going to set this for hearing.
[01:54:28.000 --> 01:54:29.000]  I'm sorry.
[01:54:29.000 --> 01:54:36.000]  You go to the court coordinator first and say, what days do you have open to hear motions?
[01:54:36.000 --> 01:54:40.000]  Give me two days and she'll give you two days.
[01:54:40.000 --> 01:54:43.000]  Then you go to the other side and say, I have these two dates.
[01:54:43.000 --> 01:54:45.000]  Which one's better for you?
[01:54:45.000 --> 01:54:49.000]  If they say neither, blah, blah, then they have to suggest one.
[01:54:49.000 --> 01:54:52.000]  If they don't, then you just go down and set it.
[01:54:52.000 --> 01:55:01.000]  The court's going to want to know that you acted in good faith with the other side to set the hearing so it's a time that's convenient.
[01:55:01.000 --> 01:55:05.000]  Then you set it with the judge's coordinator.
[01:55:05.000 --> 01:55:14.000]  Now, I don't know what they're called in Arkansas, but each judge has their own clerk that handles their calendar.
[01:55:14.000 --> 01:55:16.000]  That's it.
[01:55:16.000 --> 01:55:18.000]  Go ahead.
[01:55:18.000 --> 01:55:20.000]  I'm just saying I know who that is.
[01:55:20.000 --> 01:55:22.000]  I've talked to this person many times.
[01:55:22.000 --> 01:55:23.000]  I just didn't know.
[01:55:23.000 --> 01:55:25.000]  I needed to set it for a hearing.
[01:55:25.000 --> 01:55:26.000]  Yes.
[01:55:26.000 --> 01:55:28.000]  The court won't do it.
[01:55:28.000 --> 01:55:30.000]  You have to.
[01:55:30.000 --> 01:55:32.000]  You're the movement.
[01:55:32.000 --> 01:55:34.000]  Right.
[01:55:34.000 --> 01:55:35.000]  Okay.
[01:55:35.000 --> 01:55:42.000]  We'll do that and perhaps even try to find an attorney who might just show up to present or argue it.
[01:55:42.000 --> 01:55:52.000]  If you have a well-argued issue, it's a lot easier to get an attorney to step in there and take credit for it.
[01:55:52.000 --> 01:55:53.000]  Sure.
[01:55:53.000 --> 01:55:58.000]  I'll tell you, in this state, I can't find anybody with a spine who knows how to fight these things.
[01:55:58.000 --> 01:56:04.000]  If they hear that you're fighting against a bank, most of these guys don't even want to touch it.
[01:56:04.000 --> 01:56:10.000]  It's ridiculous because I've been looking for somebody over the last week who could simply show up to do this.
[01:56:10.000 --> 01:56:12.000]  I said that I'd do it.
[01:56:12.000 --> 01:56:17.000]  Somebody could come in there and claim $10,000 to $15,000 in attorney fees.
[01:56:17.000 --> 01:56:19.000]  It would have taken them some significant time to...
[01:56:19.000 --> 01:56:20.000]  No, no, no.
[01:56:20.000 --> 01:56:23.000]  They're not going to go $10,000, $15,000.
[01:56:23.000 --> 01:56:24.000]  Yes.
[01:56:24.000 --> 01:56:26.000]  Well, it's something substantial.
[01:56:26.000 --> 01:56:28.000]  This is a hefty thing.
[01:56:28.000 --> 01:56:33.000]  The people that know how to do it who are experts, I'm sure, are worth some money.
[01:56:33.000 --> 01:56:34.000]  They do the work.
[01:56:34.000 --> 01:56:36.000]  It's worth it.
[01:56:36.000 --> 01:56:38.000]  Anyway, I'm just saying...
[01:56:38.000 --> 01:56:41.000]  Then let me make a political suggestion.
[01:56:41.000 --> 01:56:42.000]  I'm listening.
[01:56:42.000 --> 01:57:01.000]  Send an inquiry to the court for references to lawyers who address these kinds of issues as you have been attempting to locate counsel and are unable to find an attorney to represent this case.
[01:57:01.000 --> 01:57:06.000]  Does the court have a list of attorneys that represent these kind of cases?
[01:57:06.000 --> 01:57:16.000]  And all that's for is to say, yes, I'm coming before you, pro se, but it's not on purpose.
[01:57:16.000 --> 01:57:21.000]  So don't get PO'd at me because no attorneys will take my issue.
[01:57:21.000 --> 01:57:22.000]  Okay.
[01:57:22.000 --> 01:57:25.000]  This should be a letter to the court and I'd follow with a search spark.
[01:57:25.000 --> 01:57:26.000]  Yes.
[01:57:26.000 --> 01:57:30.000]  It might be better to send it to the court coordinator.
[01:57:30.000 --> 01:57:36.000]  Because if you send a direct inquiry to the judge, sometimes they get a little testy.
[01:57:36.000 --> 01:57:40.000]  But as long as it doesn't address anything going to the issues, it shouldn't be a problem.
[01:57:40.000 --> 01:57:52.000]  But if you give it to the court coordinator and ask the coordinator to ask the judge, then you don't run the risk of getting the judge feeling like you're trying to get an ex parte here.
[01:57:52.000 --> 01:57:53.000]  Got it.
[01:57:53.000 --> 01:57:56.000]  Would that be the circuit court then, just something to the circuit court, do you think?
[01:57:56.000 --> 01:58:00.000]  That would be the court wherever you got your motion filed.
[01:58:00.000 --> 01:58:01.000]  Right.
[01:58:01.000 --> 01:58:04.000]  You didn't want to file that with the circuit court.
[01:58:04.000 --> 01:58:05.000]  Okay.
[01:58:05.000 --> 01:58:07.000]  Yeah.
[01:58:07.000 --> 01:58:11.000]  The lady that you've been talking with, call her.
[01:58:11.000 --> 01:58:12.000]  No, don't call her.
[01:58:12.000 --> 01:58:13.000]  Do it right.
[01:58:13.000 --> 01:58:15.000]  Yeah, send her that.
[01:58:15.000 --> 01:58:19.000]  But call her when you set it for hearing.
[01:58:19.000 --> 01:58:22.000]  And don't ask her directly, ask her to ask the judge.
[01:58:22.000 --> 01:58:25.000]  If she knows someone directly, she can do that.
[01:58:25.000 --> 01:58:27.000]  She can give them to you.
[01:58:27.000 --> 01:58:34.000]  But if she doesn't, and most likely if you ask her to ask the judge, she will.
[01:58:34.000 --> 01:58:38.000]  You don't care if he says, I can't, that's okay.
[01:58:38.000 --> 01:58:40.000]  We're about to go to break.
[01:58:40.000 --> 01:58:42.000]  No, we're about to end the show for the night.
[01:58:42.000 --> 01:58:45.000]  Oh, that's a long break.
[01:58:45.000 --> 01:58:47.000]  A very long break.
[01:58:47.000 --> 01:58:48.000]  Thank you for listening.
[01:58:48.000 --> 01:58:50.000]  Good night.
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