[00:00.000 --> 00:09.640] Some 50,000 new housing units in Jerusalem neighborhoods beyond the Green Line are in [00:09.640 --> 00:12.520] various states of planning and approval. [00:12.520 --> 00:17.520] Most of the units will be built in predominantly Jewish neighborhoods beyond the Green Line, [00:17.520 --> 00:20.960] while a smaller number will be built in Arab neighborhoods. [00:20.960 --> 00:26.640] Vice President Joe Biden condemned the move, saying the decision undermined peace talks. [00:26.640 --> 00:31.480] The U.S. State Department Friday issued its annual Human Rights Report, and once again [00:31.480 --> 00:37.800] the human rights situation in America's two largest battlegrounds, Afghanistan and Iraq, [00:37.800 --> 00:39.140] continued to worsen. [00:39.140 --> 00:44.720] The Afghanistan report focused on the civilians killed, blaming the Taliban for the increase [00:44.720 --> 00:46.440] in civilian deaths. [00:46.440 --> 00:52.960] It also pointed out human trafficking, restrictions on press and religion, torture and poor prison [00:52.960 --> 00:54.320] conditions. [00:54.320 --> 01:04.240] A brief mention was given to the massive civilian toll from NATO airstrikes. [01:04.240 --> 01:10.880] In Somalia, 43 people were killed and hundreds wounded in the past 48 hours as dueling offensives [01:10.880 --> 01:16.280] by the African Union-backed Somali government and the militant faction led to some of the [01:16.280 --> 01:19.140] fiercest fighting in weeks. [01:19.140 --> 01:24.560] Most of the casualties were civilians and fighting prevented wounded people from being rescued [01:24.560 --> 01:27.440] as they lay dying in the street. [01:27.440 --> 01:33.200] Karl Rove, a senior adviser to former President George Bush, has defended harsh interrogation [01:33.200 --> 01:38.480] techniques such as waterboarding, saying he was proud of the intelligence the U.S. gained [01:38.480 --> 01:40.080] from using them. [01:40.080 --> 01:46.800] Rove was often referred to as Bush's brain and is credited with Bush's electoral successes. [01:46.800 --> 01:52.440] Last January, Barack Obama barred the use of waterboarding after defining it as a form [01:52.440 --> 01:57.560] of torture. [01:57.560 --> 02:03.440] A bank examiner's report says Lehman Brothers used accounting sleight of hand to conceal [02:03.440 --> 02:07.080] the bad investments that led to its undoing. [02:07.080 --> 02:12.640] The report concluded Lehman died from bad mortgage holdings and less directly, demands [02:12.640 --> 02:18.640] by rivals like JPMorgan Chase and Citigroup that the Founding Bank post-collateral against [02:18.640 --> 02:25.240] loans it desperately needed, but the examiner Anton Valloukas laid out what the report characterized [02:25.240 --> 02:31.180] as, quote, materially misleading accounting gimmicks that Lehman used to mask the perilous [02:31.180 --> 02:33.200] state of its finances. [02:33.200 --> 02:38.160] Lehman's bankruptcy, the largest in U.S. history, shook the financial world. [02:38.160 --> 02:42.960] According to the report, Lehman used what amounted to financial engineering to temporarily [02:42.960 --> 02:48.800] shuffle $50 billion of troubled assets off its books in the months before its collapse [02:48.800 --> 03:10.160] in September 2008 to conceal its dependence on borrowed money. [03:48.800 --> 04:15.560] And tonight, we have very special guest, Michael Maris. [04:15.560 --> 04:18.280] Thank you for joining us tonight, Michael. [04:18.280 --> 04:19.280] Thanks for having me. [04:19.280 --> 04:21.000] This is awesome. [04:21.000 --> 04:26.760] Michael Maris, of the famed Michael Maris Proven Method, which you can get here on Rule [04:26.760 --> 04:34.800] of Law Radio website, it's his document that will teach you how to stop the debt collectors [04:34.800 --> 04:39.440] and how to take your life back and how to get them out of your credit report and all [04:39.440 --> 04:40.440] these kinds of things. [04:40.440 --> 04:46.320] So, Michael, why don't you give us an overview of how you got into all this and how you learned [04:46.320 --> 04:51.120] how to beat these debt collectors, stop these debt collectors and give us an overview of [04:51.120 --> 04:52.920] what's been happening lately. [04:52.920 --> 04:55.000] Okay, I will. [04:55.000 --> 05:01.480] And the first thing I want to say is that I am not an attorney and I'm not giving legal [05:01.480 --> 05:04.180] advice to anybody. [05:04.180 --> 05:09.760] This is only from my own personal experience in the federal courts and also the experience [05:09.760 --> 05:16.400] of other people that I have guided to get there and their results. [05:16.400 --> 05:24.400] So that being said, I got into this about, I guess it's about seven years ago now. [05:24.400 --> 05:30.000] And had gone through a divorce and, you know, things change when you go through a divorce [05:30.000 --> 05:35.920] and gainfully employed and making good money and I just couldn't reason with these guys. [05:35.920 --> 05:41.720] You know, they were messing up my credit report and so on and so forth and I said there's [05:41.720 --> 05:46.120] got to be a way to resolve these issues. [05:46.120 --> 05:53.600] And I joined a couple of consumer groups and I started to learn the basics there and unfortunately [05:53.600 --> 05:59.520] the consumer groups I was in weren't going into federal court with the Fair Credit Reporting [05:59.520 --> 06:08.040] Act and the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act, both of which are federal laws. [06:08.040 --> 06:11.520] And I took the initiative. [06:11.520 --> 06:17.240] The first case I had I learned on and then I found out how easy it was after I learned [06:17.240 --> 06:21.760] it and of course you're always a little concerned when you get into doing something like this. [06:21.760 --> 06:26.640] I'm going into a federal court room, you know, are these guys going to, you know, arrest [06:26.640 --> 06:31.520] me or kick me out or, you know, you're just a little old pro se litigant. [06:31.520 --> 06:33.560] What do you know? [06:33.560 --> 06:38.920] And one of the first cases that everybody kind of chuckles about it that I had was over [06:38.920 --> 06:44.960] Mexican taxes and I had worked for a U.S. company in Mexico. [06:44.960 --> 06:54.960] I used to cross the border every day and when I left there, it was about six months after [06:54.960 --> 07:01.200] I left they sent me a letter saying that you owe us approximately three thousand dollars [07:01.200 --> 07:08.840] in taxes that we pay to the Mexican government for you and I found that rather interesting [07:08.840 --> 07:16.000] because the contract that I had signed with them said that upon my leaving or termination [07:16.000 --> 07:23.440] from the company any funds owed to the company would be deducted from my last paycheck. [07:23.440 --> 07:28.400] So the question I had in my mind is why didn't you do that? [07:28.400 --> 07:33.080] The old story, you screw up and I get the pay, is that how it works? [07:33.080 --> 07:38.680] And I copped an attitude and I said, no, I'm not going to let these guys push me around. [07:38.680 --> 07:41.560] They sent it to a commercial debt collector. [07:41.560 --> 07:45.920] Within the first letter I got from them I had them on six violations of the Debt Collection [07:45.920 --> 07:50.000] Practice Act and they made their big mistake. [07:50.000 --> 08:01.480] They gave it to an attorney to come after me to collect on and this attorney was clueless. [08:01.480 --> 08:02.480] Sent me a letter. [08:02.480 --> 08:07.120] I sent him out what we call a validation letter which is in my course, very simple, one page, [08:07.120 --> 08:10.640] you don't know nothing, play dumb. [08:10.640 --> 08:12.840] Don't be like some of these guys do. [08:12.840 --> 08:16.400] They want to send out all these letters and threaten these guys, we're going to take you [08:16.400 --> 08:17.400] to court. [08:17.400 --> 08:18.400] No, no, no, no, no. [08:18.400 --> 08:20.720] Go there. [08:20.720 --> 08:27.880] These guys manage well enough to shoot themselves in the foot without any help from you. [08:27.880 --> 08:31.640] So you play the dumb, know nothing consumer. [08:31.640 --> 08:37.400] Anyhow, this letter came and yeah, you owe this money and while I sent them the validation [08:37.400 --> 08:40.800] letter I said, hey, I don't know who the heck you are, you know, prove to me I owe something [08:40.800 --> 08:46.240] and by the way, don't call me at home or at work. [08:46.240 --> 08:51.160] Why contact me by U.S. mail at my home address? [08:51.160 --> 08:58.920] So he sent me back what he considered validation of a debt of copies of copies of copies of [08:58.920 --> 09:02.280] copies of faxes that were in Spanish. [09:02.280 --> 09:11.080] Okay, well I have to keep to Espanol and even if I spoke perfect Spanish I would have trouble [09:11.080 --> 09:16.360] reading these things because it had been copied so many times you couldn't even see half the [09:16.360 --> 09:17.360] letters. [09:17.360 --> 09:21.960] Anyhow, unfortunately when he sent me the cover letter with that he forgot to give me [09:21.960 --> 09:24.480] my consumer warning. [09:24.480 --> 09:26.240] We call it the mini Miranda warning. [09:26.240 --> 09:29.360] This is an attempt to collect the debt and any information obtained will be used for [09:29.360 --> 09:30.360] that purpose. [09:30.360 --> 09:33.760] God, I got that memorized, that's terrible. [09:33.760 --> 09:37.320] Anyhow, got to put that on there. [09:37.320 --> 09:40.840] Well that's a thousand dollar violation. [09:40.840 --> 09:42.920] Book story, this made short. [09:42.920 --> 09:46.760] This went on for quite a few months back and forth and then finally I sent him a notice [09:46.760 --> 09:47.760] of pending lawsuits. [09:47.760 --> 09:52.720] If you don't resolve these issues I'm going to take you into the federal court and I'm [09:52.720 --> 09:58.080] going to file for your violation of the Debt Collection Practices Act. [09:58.080 --> 10:02.880] And I hadn't heard from him in three or four months and he sent me a letter and he says, [10:02.880 --> 10:03.880] oh, wait, wait, wait. [10:03.880 --> 10:11.760] I called you on December 8th, December 10th, December 13th and December 15th. [10:11.760 --> 10:16.440] He just admitted in writing in black and white that he violated the limited cease and desist [10:16.440 --> 10:18.560] within the validation letter. [10:18.560 --> 10:22.640] Four more violations. [10:22.640 --> 10:26.360] And I had gotten him on four already previous to that and I figure I was going into court [10:26.360 --> 10:35.680] with a $4,000 complaint instead I went in with an $8,000 complaint plus damages. [10:35.680 --> 10:40.360] The case was set to good faith conferences. [10:40.360 --> 10:47.400] Second meeting with his attorney, he, after 45 minute conversation, he looked at me and [10:47.400 --> 10:52.600] he says, we'd like to resolve this, we'd like to make this go away. [10:52.600 --> 10:56.720] We'll give you X amount of dollars and, you know, we'll cease collection, we'll put it [10:56.720 --> 11:00.600] all in writing, we'll have a settlement agreement, which is something you always demand, everything [11:00.600 --> 11:03.280] in writing. [11:03.280 --> 11:08.840] And okay, I shut the stenographer off that I hired because I know enough that when I'm [11:08.840 --> 11:15.960] talking to a lawyer and it involves lawsuits and the courts, it's always a good idea to [11:15.960 --> 11:21.300] bring your own stenographer along to have him or her write everything down because then [11:21.300 --> 11:25.400] attorneys have a tendency to tell the truth when that happens because they know everything's [11:25.400 --> 11:26.400] being written down. [11:26.400 --> 11:31.400] Geez, isn't that a son of a gun for them to have to do, huh? [11:31.400 --> 11:34.720] Anyway, I turned the stenographer off. [11:34.720 --> 11:40.320] We sat there talking about the case a little bit and I says, yeah, I was really interested [11:40.320 --> 11:46.820] in going to interrogatories with you because my first question to you would have been, [11:46.820 --> 11:51.820] what is your authority to collect Mexican taxes? [11:51.820 --> 11:59.480] My second question would have been, what is your authority to collect taxes for anybody? [11:59.480 --> 12:03.520] And my third would have been, under production of documents, produce the documents that say [12:03.520 --> 12:05.400] you're allowed to collect taxes. [12:05.400 --> 12:10.840] And he kind of sat there and he shook his head, he said, yeah, well, he says, I understand [12:10.840 --> 12:16.440] and he says, but I have to tell you, you had us on four charges, four violations that we [12:16.440 --> 12:19.720] had no defense for. [12:19.720 --> 12:24.440] So if we had gone to trial, I probably could have made a lot more money. [12:24.440 --> 12:28.880] Anyhow, with that, he got up and left. [12:28.880 --> 12:34.680] The stenographer looked at me and she says, I've been doing this for ten years, I've never [12:34.680 --> 12:36.640] seen anything like that. [12:36.640 --> 12:39.960] I says, well, you know, when you're right, you're right. [12:39.960 --> 12:40.960] You can prove it. [12:40.960 --> 12:43.360] It's a done deal. [12:43.360 --> 12:47.000] He did make some comments to me because I know Debbie wants me to say this. [12:47.000 --> 12:50.720] She gets a kick out of it. [12:50.720 --> 12:53.400] Just before he left the room, we talked about the settlement agreement. [12:53.400 --> 12:56.440] He says, yeah, we want a settlement agreement, you know. [12:56.440 --> 13:05.860] We don't want appearing in tomorrow's newspaper, beach bum pro se litigate beats attorney. [13:05.860 --> 13:08.720] So take that for what it's worth, folks. [13:08.720 --> 13:15.000] And you know, I can't disclose a lot of information, but my credibility is pretty solid. [13:15.000 --> 13:18.120] I have six cases in PACER. [13:18.120 --> 13:19.640] You don't know what PACER is. [13:19.640 --> 13:29.120] That's the government website or all the federal court filings, which are public knowledge. [13:29.120 --> 13:34.720] Anybody can go there and sign up, join PACER, you can go in there and query my last name [13:34.720 --> 13:36.160] and you'll see my cases. [13:36.160 --> 13:37.440] It's that simple. [13:37.440 --> 13:46.920] Now of course, I've been involved with this for quite a while and have worked with numerous [13:46.920 --> 13:54.840] people that I can also refer you to if we look up who have done this. [13:54.840 --> 13:56.880] It's amazing what's going on right now. [13:56.880 --> 14:02.680] I have tons and tons of clients that I'm working with. [14:02.680 --> 14:07.080] My course will get you up and into the federal court, but at that point, if you've never [14:07.080 --> 14:16.120] been in a federal court room or what we call rule 26F, which is discovery, that's when [14:16.120 --> 14:20.080] you're going to need to bring me on as a consultant. [14:20.080 --> 14:24.600] I do get a consulting fee, but it's pretty reasonable and you get a lot of my time to [14:24.600 --> 14:26.000] walk you through this. [14:26.000 --> 14:28.200] It's pretty simple what you learn. [14:28.200 --> 14:33.160] But the bottom line to all this is most of the time these debt collectors don't want [14:33.160 --> 14:35.800] to go into federal court. [14:35.800 --> 14:41.040] You can ask them some very embarrassing questions if it goes to 26F, discovery, like how much [14:41.040 --> 14:43.480] did you pay for this account? [14:43.480 --> 14:48.800] Provide the documentation that shows you actually represent this creditor. [14:48.800 --> 14:51.920] Did you buy this debt or are you representing the creditor? [14:51.920 --> 14:56.520] I mean, you can hit them with a lot of questions they don't want to answer. [14:56.520 --> 15:01.440] If you get one of these debt collectors and say, oh, we own the debt, we bought it, good, [15:01.440 --> 15:02.440] what did you pay for it? [15:02.440 --> 15:08.160] And if you know anything about this stuff, they bundle this stuff up just like they do [15:08.160 --> 15:14.680] the mortgages and sell them off in packages to various debt collectors. [15:14.680 --> 15:19.320] And essentially it costs two to three cents on the dollar to buy one of these debts. [15:19.320 --> 15:24.320] So if you've got a $5,000 debt, they paid 100 bucks for it. [15:24.320 --> 15:29.720] How would you like to be able to have them admit to that in discovery, that they're trying [15:29.720 --> 15:33.280] to collect $5,000 but they only paid $100 for it? [15:33.280 --> 15:40.760] Does anybody see anything wrong with this little thing called fraud upon the consumer? [15:40.760 --> 15:41.760] It's pretty interesting. [15:41.760 --> 15:49.160] I had a lady I was working with the past couple of days, actually contacted me two days ago. [15:49.160 --> 15:52.680] She's out of Chicago. [15:52.680 --> 15:53.680] She's bad. [15:53.680 --> 15:55.680] She's got default judgment against her. [15:55.680 --> 15:58.360] They've been trying to garnish her wages. [15:58.360 --> 16:01.680] She followed the course, did everything she was supposed to do with the debt collector [16:01.680 --> 16:07.680] and got him on some violations and she sent him notice of pending lawsuit and he ignored [16:07.680 --> 16:08.680] it. [16:08.680 --> 16:13.360] Well, when he ignored that, she went ahead and filed, we give you ten days to respond. [16:13.360 --> 16:18.600] If you don't respond, we're going to file in federal court. [16:18.600 --> 16:19.920] He didn't respond. [16:19.920 --> 16:23.880] She files in federal court in paparis, which means she's a poor person. [16:23.880 --> 16:25.880] She couldn't afford a $350 fine. [16:25.880 --> 16:30.960] It's just a matter of filling out a few pages, turning it into the court and the judge is [16:30.960 --> 16:32.440] just between you and the judge. [16:32.440 --> 16:35.040] The information is not shared with anyone else. [16:35.040 --> 16:39.400] Judge, let you in and in paparis and then you don't have to worry about anything else. [16:39.400 --> 16:40.400] Okay. [16:40.400 --> 16:41.400] Mike, hold on. [16:41.400 --> 16:42.400] We're going to break here. [16:42.400 --> 16:43.400] Okay. [16:43.400 --> 16:45.800] We want to hear more about this on the other side. [16:45.800 --> 16:50.680] We're here with a very special guest, Michael Maris, talking about how to stop third party [16:50.680 --> 16:53.480] debt collectors. [16:53.480 --> 16:56.120] We'll be taking your calls later in the evening. [16:56.120 --> 17:00.400] We'll be right back. [17:00.400 --> 17:03.840] You feel tired when talking about important topics like money and politics? [17:03.840 --> 17:04.840] Sorry. [17:04.840 --> 17:07.720] Are you confused by words like the constitution or the federal reserve? [17:07.720 --> 17:08.720] What? [17:08.720 --> 17:12.520] If so, you may be diagnosed with the deadliest disease known today, stupidity. [17:12.520 --> 17:18.080] Hi, my name is Steve Holt and like millions of other Americans, I was diagnosed with stupidity [17:18.080 --> 17:19.320] at an early age. [17:19.320 --> 17:23.280] I had no idea that the number one cause of the disease is found in almost every home [17:23.280 --> 17:25.360] in America, the television. [17:25.360 --> 17:30.400] Unfortunately, that puts most Americans at risk of catching stupidity, but there is hope. [17:30.400 --> 17:34.200] The staff at Brave New Books have helped me and thousands of other poxaholics suffering [17:34.200 --> 17:36.480] from sports zombieism recover. [17:36.480 --> 17:40.720] And because of Brave New Books, I now enjoy reading and watching educational documentaries [17:40.720 --> 17:43.360] without feeling tired or uninterested. [17:43.360 --> 17:50.760] So if you or anybody you know suffers from stupidity, then you need to call 512-480-2503 [17:50.760 --> 17:54.800] or visit them in 1904 Guadalupe or bravenewbookstore.com. [17:54.800 --> 17:58.200] Side effects from using Brave New Books products may include discernment and enlarged vocabulary [17:58.200 --> 18:21.560] and an overall increase in mental functioning. [18:21.560 --> 18:42.160] Okay, we are back, we are here with Michael Maris. [18:42.160 --> 18:51.760] Okay, Michael, so this attorney ignored this woman's tort letter and so then she filed [18:51.760 --> 18:52.760] and so what happened? [18:52.760 --> 18:56.040] And she filed, how did she file to get out of the filing fee? [18:56.040 --> 18:57.040] What was that? [18:57.040 --> 18:58.040] What was that? [18:58.040 --> 18:59.040] That's called impetuous. [18:59.040 --> 19:00.040] You are a poor person in Latin. [19:00.040 --> 19:01.040] Okay. [19:01.040 --> 19:03.960] You can't afford the $350 to file. [19:03.960 --> 19:04.960] Okay. [19:04.960 --> 19:05.960] Okay. [19:05.960 --> 19:11.040] So it's a pretty simple process when you fill out your complaint and in my courses, [19:11.040 --> 19:13.960] those forms are all there, explains how to fill them out. [19:13.960 --> 19:14.960] They are pretty simple. [19:14.960 --> 19:19.560] They ask you simple questions, you know, like how much is your rent or mortgage and how [19:19.560 --> 19:24.000] much credit card debt you might have and, you know, if you've got kids or a husband [19:24.000 --> 19:28.200] or wife that are dependents and all that, it's pretty simple. [19:28.200 --> 19:32.520] And when you file your complaint, you turn that in with the complaint and it takes the [19:32.520 --> 19:39.320] judge generally 24 to 72 hours, they make a response, you are accepted and you are done. [19:39.320 --> 19:42.840] The court will take care of serving it and everything, you don't even have to worry [19:42.840 --> 19:46.840] about having it served at the point because the U.S. Marshals serve it. [19:46.840 --> 19:51.160] I always like to say, how do you like them boys showing up at your door? [19:51.160 --> 19:52.160] U.S. Marshals. [19:52.160 --> 19:53.160] Hmm. [19:53.160 --> 19:59.320] Well, that's what happened to this lawyer, Debbie, he didn't respond to her notice of [19:59.320 --> 20:00.320] pending lawsuits. [20:00.320 --> 20:06.560] She went down there and filed, she sent me an email yesterday, contact me quick, okay. [20:06.560 --> 20:14.800] She says, the Marshals served this guy yesterday, he called me today, crying. [20:14.800 --> 20:20.640] Debt collector attorney, you know, I can't, you know, this is going to cause my insurance [20:20.640 --> 20:21.640] to go up. [20:21.640 --> 20:26.200] Yeah, well, that's too bad, I didn't cause the problem, you caused the problem. [20:26.200 --> 20:31.520] I'll work with you, I'll help you get the, no guarantees, I'll help you get the default [20:31.520 --> 20:34.360] judgment out of the lower court and blah, blah, blah. [20:34.360 --> 20:38.440] And I told her, I says, okay, that's all fine, I says, he's got 21 days to respond to the [20:38.440 --> 20:42.400] complaint, tell him that's what he's got to fix the problem. [20:42.400 --> 20:48.160] She says, I got it Mike, and I says, you know, you get some money out of it, you know, to [20:48.160 --> 20:53.080] pay to go away, a thousand bucks minimum or something, well, you know, that's between [20:53.080 --> 20:55.440] you and the defendant. [20:55.440 --> 21:03.120] But I asked her, I says, how does it feel to have the shoe on the other foot this time? [21:03.120 --> 21:05.160] Big difference. [21:05.160 --> 21:10.640] So she's a very firm believer in the process and I have many, many people, a gentleman out [21:10.640 --> 21:15.720] in California called me today, I've been working with him for a couple of months, he's picked [21:15.720 --> 21:20.280] up on this process very, very quickly, I can't believe how sharp the guy is, he's really [21:20.280 --> 21:22.000] picked up on it. [21:22.000 --> 21:25.960] He had three debt collectors after him, he sent out the validation letter to three of [21:25.960 --> 21:30.640] them, two of them responded to him and sent him a letter that said, we won't be bothering [21:30.640 --> 21:35.400] you anymore, we're sending this back to the predator. [21:35.400 --> 21:42.120] And the third one, no answer, sends them notice of pending lawsuit, no answer. [21:42.120 --> 21:46.280] So he filed and they were served today. [21:46.280 --> 21:49.720] So I says, I got a funny feeling they'll be on the phone to you within the next few days, [21:49.720 --> 21:54.080] so he says, yeah, I didn't tell, I says, yeah, see if they want to go, they, he's in California, [21:54.080 --> 21:58.060] the debt collectors in Minnesota, you know, they're going to have to hire an attorney [21:58.060 --> 22:03.320] in California that's admitted to the federal bar, you know, what does an attorney get? [22:03.320 --> 22:09.680] I always say four, five, six hundred feet in the middle, five hundred an hour, can you [22:09.680 --> 22:14.720] imagine if, you know, the attorney picks up the case, he's going to, you know, hit him [22:14.720 --> 22:20.440] with 10 hours up front, there's $5,000 right there, just answer the complaint and then [22:20.440 --> 22:26.640] he's got to go in the courtroom, his rates double generally, these cases will cost them [22:26.640 --> 22:30.920] anywhere from a, you know, a bare minimum if they don't settle right away, a couple [22:30.920 --> 22:38.240] of thousand bucks to as much as, I'm sure, 20, $25,000 to defend on these cases. [22:38.240 --> 22:46.560] And folks, if you're looking at a bad account, account that went south, that was eight, 10, [22:46.560 --> 22:53.840] 12, 15, $20,000 that they're trying to collect on, you do the math, they're going to pay [22:53.840 --> 22:59.360] some attorney to defend in court, God forbid this goes to trial, I have yet to see one [22:59.360 --> 23:06.280] of these cases go to trial, and the lawyer goes in the courtroom for two days at double [23:06.280 --> 23:13.400] his rate because he's in trial, and then you win and you've got, hypothetical, let's say [23:13.400 --> 23:19.520] a $50,000 lawsuit, so let me get the numbers straight here so everybody can understand [23:19.520 --> 23:27.520] where I'm coming from, you just won the case in federal court for $50,000, that debt collector [23:27.520 --> 23:38.440] creditor was coming after you for, and so they pay you $50,000 and they've got to pay [23:38.440 --> 23:45.600] the lawyer $20,000, so let me get this straight, that's $70,000 and they're trying to collect [23:45.600 --> 23:53.760] $5,000 or $6,000 or $8,000 or $10,000, does anybody see anything wrong with this picture? [23:53.760 --> 23:58.200] And I always chuckle about this, you know, when you go up against the lawyers, you can't [23:58.200 --> 24:03.400] do this, you can't do that, well let's let the judge and jury decide. [24:03.400 --> 24:12.160] And I have a real, these little comebacks, I tell you what, Mr. Lawyer, let's go to trial, [24:12.160 --> 24:15.600] and I win, and I will win because you're not going to find a jury that's going to have [24:15.600 --> 24:19.880] much sympathy for these guys, especially after all the bailouts and everything we've been [24:19.880 --> 24:27.760] going through here in the past year, and your client pays me the $50,000 and the check clears [24:27.760 --> 24:33.880] my bank, I'll gladly give him the $10,000 he claims I owe, no problem, do that every [24:33.880 --> 24:41.160] day of the week and twice on Sunday, see if you want to go there, let me know, it's that [24:41.160 --> 24:42.160] simple. [24:42.160 --> 24:48.120] We talked about debt collectors, generally the debt collector is representing a creditor [24:48.120 --> 24:55.440] or a former creditor, you go after the creditor under fair credit, you dispute in your credit [24:55.440 --> 25:01.200] reports, you dispute with the creditor, there's things they're supposed to do when you dispute [25:01.200 --> 25:05.320] with the debt collector, he's in your credit report, when you send him that validation [25:05.320 --> 25:11.120] letter he better mark that account in dispute, don't have to believe me folks, just go read [25:11.120 --> 25:16.760] the Fair Credit Reporting Act, Debt Collection Practices Act, they're free, the Federal Trade [25:16.760 --> 25:23.800] Commission site, easy to download, easy to print out, big thing about all this stuff, [25:23.800 --> 25:28.440] there's no monies involved in those laws and that's the hardest thing I have educating [25:28.440 --> 25:33.840] people about because everybody keeps thinking about it, I got this default judgment, I had [25:33.840 --> 25:41.840] this account, it was like eight thousand dollars and I didn't pay it back, so what? [25:41.840 --> 25:50.480] If you read those laws, the Fair Credit Debt Collection Practices Act, they don't talk [25:50.480 --> 25:56.760] about money in there at all, go read them, they don't talk about one dollar or a million [25:56.760 --> 26:06.280] dollars, nothing about money, these laws are consumer laws but they're geared at the creditors [26:06.280 --> 26:13.880] and debt collectors, what they're supposed to do when challenged and they don't do it [26:13.880 --> 26:15.160] and why don't they do it? [26:15.160 --> 26:20.680] You're dealing with big multi-million, multi-billion dollar corporations that you're just another [26:20.680 --> 26:26.800] little lowly consumer, what do you know, we're going to do what we want. [26:26.800 --> 26:32.280] Bottom line is, when you take them into federal court, it has nothing to do with any alleged [26:32.280 --> 26:40.280] account or debt, you don't even talk about money in the complaint, it's the violations [26:40.280 --> 26:47.480] of your civil rights that we're in this courtroom for, I'll say that once again, it's civil [26:47.480 --> 26:53.000] rights violations, that's what this stuff boils down to. [26:53.000 --> 26:58.160] You challenged them, they were supposed to do something, they didn't do it and they violated [26:58.160 --> 27:03.600] your civil rights by not doing it and that's what these cases go into federal court with, [27:03.600 --> 27:10.040] civil rights violations and of course the only defense they have, and I've seen it [27:10.040 --> 27:14.080] plenty of times, they go well you have this credit card and we've got this default judgment [27:14.080 --> 27:17.280] on you, so what, what does that got to do with anything? [27:17.280 --> 27:22.080] Well you owe this money, so what? [27:22.080 --> 27:27.920] If you've never been up against a lawyer who hasn't taken consumer law, you're going [27:27.920 --> 27:37.600] to educate them and once you get them educated, the lights come on, say yeah man, it's not [27:37.600 --> 27:43.080] about what I'm supposed to do or what I'm supposed to pay, it's what your client is [27:43.080 --> 27:48.800] required to do when challenged and they didn't do it and that's why we're in this courtroom, [27:48.800 --> 27:52.280] it's that simple, it's that simple. [27:52.280 --> 27:56.120] A gentleman I'm working with, I've known for a number of years in Louisiana, just filed [27:56.120 --> 28:04.640] his first federal suit a couple of weeks ago, he's one of the big banks, under fair credit, [28:04.640 --> 28:10.520] I'd have a conference call with the judge, now you go to federal court, let me make this [28:10.520 --> 28:14.200] very clear to you, it's not like the local courtrooms where you see everybody hanging [28:14.200 --> 28:19.720] out in the hallways, people out there crying, 100 people in the hallways, lawyers all over [28:19.720 --> 28:25.440] the place arguing, you don't see that in the federal court. [28:25.440 --> 28:29.200] It's almost like a ghost town when you go in there because they're much more organized [28:29.200 --> 28:31.440] than the local courts. [28:31.440 --> 28:38.960] Who you will deal with in the local court is the clerk where you file your forms. [28:38.960 --> 28:43.480] Subsequently this gentleman that I know from Louisiana, and I've known him I guess five [28:43.480 --> 28:52.800] or six years, he finally filed his first court case and they requested a rule 16 conference [28:52.800 --> 28:55.800] call. [28:55.800 --> 29:02.280] Phone call folks, phone call, you, the defendant's attorney and the judge. [29:02.280 --> 29:07.720] So you could be sitting home in your underwear drinking a cup of coffee on the phone doing [29:07.720 --> 29:10.120] this, okay? [29:10.120 --> 29:17.360] The interesting thing to the conversation, my guy was really, really pumped up when this [29:17.360 --> 29:18.360] happened. [29:18.360 --> 29:28.600] He said the judge said that during the conversation, gee I don't know too much about this fair [29:28.600 --> 29:33.720] credit debt collection law. [29:33.720 --> 29:42.080] And I hear the commercial break coming up, I can't wait to hear the rest of this story. [29:42.080 --> 29:48.640] The lawyers telling the judge, gee I don't know too much about this, somehow I have a [29:48.640 --> 29:54.680] feeling the results were not too pretty for that attorney. [29:54.680 --> 29:58.040] We'll be right back on the other side, we're here with our very special guest, Michael [29:58.040 --> 30:03.720] Clearis. [30:03.720 --> 30:07.040] Win your case without an attorney with Jurisdictionary. [30:07.040 --> 30:13.680] The affordable, easy to understand, 4 CD course that will show you how in 24 hours, step by [30:13.680 --> 30:14.680] step. [30:14.680 --> 30:18.120] If you have a lawyer, know what your lawyer should be doing. [30:18.120 --> 30:22.360] If you don't have a lawyer, know what you should do for yourself. [30:22.360 --> 30:28.280] Thousands have won with our step by step course and now you can too. [30:28.280 --> 30:33.320] Jurisdictionary was created by a licensed attorney with 22 years of case winning experience. [30:33.320 --> 30:38.720] Even if you're not in a lawsuit, you can learn what everyone should understand about the [30:38.720 --> 30:42.560] principles and practices that control our American courts. [30:42.560 --> 30:49.200] You'll receive our audio classroom, video seminar, tutorials, forms for civil cases, [30:49.200 --> 30:55.880] pro se tactics and much more, please visit ruleoflawradio.com and click on the banner [30:55.880 --> 30:58.880] or call toll free, 866-LAW-EZ. [30:58.880 --> 31:20.000] Okay, so Mike, what happened? [31:20.000 --> 31:21.000] What happened to this? [31:21.000 --> 31:25.640] I don't even want to say poor attorney because I'm sure he deserved it but what happened [31:25.640 --> 31:30.480] to this attorney after he tells the judge, gee, I don't know too much about this? [31:30.480 --> 31:35.480] Well, no, actually it was the judge who said he didn't know too much about the law. [31:35.480 --> 31:38.480] Oh, that's even worse. [31:38.480 --> 31:39.480] Yeah. [31:39.480 --> 31:44.760] So, my buddy there, he started explaining a little bit and he explains to him that, [31:44.760 --> 31:52.200] well, your honor, they failed to mark my account in dispute, the law requires them to do that. [31:52.200 --> 32:00.280] And the judge says to the attorney, on the other phone, of course, how come your client [32:00.280 --> 32:02.920] didn't mark the man's account in dispute? [32:02.920 --> 32:09.480] Uh-oh, the light bulb just came on for the judge. [32:09.480 --> 32:13.960] That's what we're in here for, folks, they don't follow the rules. [32:13.960 --> 32:19.520] So my guy was pretty high when he called me to tell me the results of that conversation. [32:19.520 --> 32:21.440] I says, you mean the judge might get it? [32:21.440 --> 32:22.440] He says, yeah. [32:22.440 --> 32:26.400] I says, yeah, you might have to educate him a little bit more but that's okay, you know, [32:26.400 --> 32:30.640] it's in black and white, here's the law, you know, just read it. [32:30.640 --> 32:34.000] So maybe that's what the judge is doing this weekend, going to read the Fair Credit and [32:34.000 --> 32:39.200] the Debt Collection Practices Act so we can understand the case. [32:39.200 --> 32:44.000] But I don't think I want to be that attorney after that comment that the judge made to [32:44.000 --> 32:45.000] him. [32:45.000 --> 32:46.320] Why didn't your client do that? [32:46.320 --> 32:48.480] Why didn't they mark the account in dispute? [32:48.480 --> 32:55.080] Hmm, that's why we're in this courtroom, your honor, to figure that one out. [32:55.080 --> 32:59.040] So he's off to a pretty good start. [32:59.040 --> 33:06.960] So Michael, the thing here is that we want to get them on these violations of the Fair [33:06.960 --> 33:12.880] Debt Collection Practices Act and the Fair Credit Reporting Act, these kinds of things [33:12.880 --> 33:18.040] and hopefully you can get them to rack up more violations, at least as many or more [33:18.040 --> 33:24.440] where the fines would equal or greater the amount of the debt, is that kind of the leverage [33:24.440 --> 33:27.280] that we want to put on these people, is that the strategy? [33:27.280 --> 33:31.240] It's always good to have those big numbers but sometimes if you're in a corner and you [33:31.240 --> 33:36.960] don't have a lot of time to get them, you can go in with what you got and your damages [33:36.960 --> 33:41.840] will pick up the other half, okay? [33:41.840 --> 33:47.280] And here's the scenario, if they're in your credit report, this is the debt collector, [33:47.280 --> 33:52.880] the creditor who's ever in there causing you this problem and when you go after debt collector, [33:52.880 --> 33:58.840] they're generally representing or they claim they represent or they're collecting for or [33:58.840 --> 34:03.240] even if they bought the debt, the old creditor is in there, you challenge the old creditor, [34:03.240 --> 34:05.320] you send them dispute letters. [34:05.320 --> 34:09.640] The old creditor has to mark the account in dispute, they need to do an investigation, [34:09.640 --> 34:12.920] they don't do it, it's that simple. [34:12.920 --> 34:19.560] So that's two $1,000 violations, the first one is they fail to mark the account in dispute, [34:19.560 --> 34:24.120] the second one is they're reporting erroneous and inaccurate information because you never [34:24.120 --> 34:28.880] provided me proof of any alleged account. [34:28.880 --> 34:38.200] Now if they're in three bureaus, that's $6,000 in violations, $1,000 for each violation across [34:38.200 --> 34:44.360] three bureaus, failure to mark the account in dispute, $1,000, reporting erroneous and [34:44.360 --> 34:52.180] inaccurate information, another $1,000, $2,000 there across three bureaus is $6,000. [34:52.180 --> 34:57.320] Same with the debt collector who's in your credit report, you send them the validation [34:57.320 --> 35:01.800] letter, you're putting them on notice, they need to mark your dispute in this darn thing, [35:01.800 --> 35:06.480] you need to mark the account in dispute in my credit report and when you don't provide [35:06.480 --> 35:11.800] me proof of any account, you're reporting erroneous and inaccurate information. [35:11.800 --> 35:17.760] So if you're across three bureaus, debt collector's another $6,000, so there's $12,000 in violations [35:17.760 --> 35:24.840] right there, but you see it gets better because you see they update these things every month [35:24.840 --> 35:32.040] in the credit report, so they break the law every month and it becomes a multiplier. [35:32.040 --> 35:37.720] This month you get them, all right, you got $12,000. [35:37.720 --> 35:42.600] Thirty days later they update that report, didn't mark it in dispute, didn't prove to [35:42.600 --> 35:50.600] you you owed something, here's $24,000, okay, and it just keeps going. [35:50.600 --> 36:02.280] If you can wait ten months, well, you'd have $120,000 just in violations plus damages. [36:02.280 --> 36:10.400] So the points rack up pretty quickly and if you don't understand the situation with them [36:10.400 --> 36:15.940] updating monthly, I'll give you, I always use a very simple scenario, a guy goes and [36:15.940 --> 36:24.760] robs a bank in May, robs a bank in June, robs a bank in July, and July the cops catch him [36:24.760 --> 36:30.080] and they know this guy robbed the bank in May and June because they got pictures of [36:30.080 --> 36:34.680] him and all that stuff, but they won't charge him with those crimes, they just charge him [36:34.680 --> 36:38.000] with the first or the last one that they caught him at, right, is that the way the system [36:38.000 --> 36:39.000] works? [36:39.000 --> 36:41.060] I don't think so. [36:41.060 --> 36:46.960] So it is not a right for them to update that report every month, they're breaking the law [36:46.960 --> 36:51.500] every time they do it, it's that simple. [36:51.500 --> 36:55.200] So you can rack up the violations very, very quickly. [36:55.200 --> 37:00.920] Some people I talked with gentleman today out of the Austin area had called me and we [37:00.920 --> 37:04.760] were talking and he said, well Mike, I've got some old ones in my account, he says I [37:04.760 --> 37:09.920] like to get going and we kind of talked about that, he's not under any pressure, he says [37:09.920 --> 37:14.840] my credit report is messed up now so he says I can afford to wait, I says get your validations [37:14.840 --> 37:20.680] out now because you may not be ready to go to court on these for six months, in the meantime [37:20.680 --> 37:25.060] you're racking up all the violations on them. [37:25.060 --> 37:31.120] So I don't recommend anybody, unless you're in dire straits, trying to take on two or [37:31.120 --> 37:36.760] three of these cases at one time in federal court because you will be overwhelmed with [37:36.760 --> 37:44.320] it, and that's what 95% of this whole thing is, it's a paper push, you very seldom go [37:44.320 --> 37:52.360] in the court room, you might have a rule 16 conference in the judge's chambers, it's [37:52.360 --> 37:57.840] totally informal, no one's under oath, you're not in a court room, you're in the judge's [37:57.840 --> 37:58.840] chambers. [37:58.840 --> 38:04.240] I have a young lady, I've worked with this stuff, she had a case of, oh I guess maybe [38:04.240 --> 38:09.440] she settled it about three or four months ago, it was around the first part of the year, [38:09.440 --> 38:16.760] and she got called into one of these rule 16 conferences in the judge's chamber between [38:16.760 --> 38:22.200] her, the defendant's attorney and the judge, so I figured she's going in the federal court [38:22.200 --> 38:26.640] room, you've got to have the right appearance and everything, she puts on the nice lady's [38:26.640 --> 38:33.240] business suit and the black suit and the whole nine yards with the jacket, she goes into [38:33.240 --> 38:38.080] the judge's chambers and there's the judge sitting there in a golf short and shorts and [38:38.080 --> 38:45.760] sandals, I don't know how much more laid back you can get than that. [38:45.760 --> 38:49.240] So they had their little conference and walked away, anyhow it took her three months to get [38:49.240 --> 38:55.920] the case settled, they paid her to go away, and that was the end of it, they do a settlement [38:55.920 --> 38:59.080] agreement, we're never going to sell this to another debt collector, we're not going [38:59.080 --> 39:03.560] to report it now in the future in any of your credit reports, we're not going to sell this [39:03.560 --> 39:07.520] to a debt collector attorney, get it all in writing, they sign it, you sign it, now you [39:07.520 --> 39:14.200] got a contract, God forbid they break that contract, I'm sure you could find an attorney [39:14.200 --> 39:19.680] who understands contract law, you wouldn't have to do anything. [39:19.680 --> 39:27.160] So it gets pretty interesting once you learn how to do this, and the neat thing about it [39:27.160 --> 39:31.280] is you've got to pay for these courses up front, and I always say if you get something [39:31.280 --> 39:36.800] for nothing, that's exactly what it's worth. [39:36.800 --> 39:42.720] The course will have my email in it, so you'll be able to email me, I will answer and work [39:42.720 --> 39:48.880] with you on simple questions, get you up in the federal court, you win one case, they're [39:48.880 --> 39:54.200] going to offer you money to go away, and it could be as little as a thousand dollars and [39:54.200 --> 40:00.280] sometimes it's considerably more, but if you bought the course and you paid for it, you [40:00.280 --> 40:04.400] just got a thousand dollars from your first case, the first question I always ask everybody [40:04.400 --> 40:09.160] is how much did that course cost you? [40:09.160 --> 40:12.720] And then if you have to do it a second time, how much did the course cost you? [40:12.720 --> 40:17.000] Or a third time, how much did the course cost you? [40:17.000 --> 40:22.800] And you're getting paid to go away, and generally like I say the bare minimum of that is a thousand [40:22.800 --> 40:28.760] bucks, you know, I've seen it all over the place, but a thousand dollars, you know, if [40:28.760 --> 40:34.160] they want to settle before they've got to go in that courtroom, no problem, notice of [40:34.160 --> 40:38.160] the pending lawsuit, you know, even like I told you about this one guy that called me [40:38.160 --> 40:42.720] and they said the debt collector sent them a letter and said they're going away, well [40:42.720 --> 40:46.320] that's nice, I'm glad you're going away, that doesn't forgive you for breaking the law, [40:46.320 --> 40:49.680] so what water can we break? [40:49.680 --> 40:56.000] I asked you to validate and you didn't, but your choice is they either have to validate [40:56.000 --> 41:04.480] it or cease collection, but here's the interesting thing folks, a lot of times they send you [41:04.480 --> 41:10.560] this letter, I have a gentleman in Florida right now that has two of them from a debt [41:10.560 --> 41:17.800] collector, an addict, and in the letter it says things like contact this office right [41:17.800 --> 41:24.080] away to make arrangements to pay for this thing or contact this office in 24 hours or [41:24.080 --> 41:31.280] call this office right away, you can't do that, there's a little thing called overshadowing, [41:31.280 --> 41:36.880] overshadowing, and it is in the Debt Collection Practices Act, you go read it, there's a couple [41:36.880 --> 41:42.880] paragraphs about it, and it has to do with the consumer warning that this is an attempt [41:42.880 --> 41:46.680] to collect the debt and the information obtained will be used for that purpose and it's a long [41:46.680 --> 41:51.880] paragraph that goes in and they talk about the consumer warning, the debt collector may [41:51.880 --> 41:58.840] not overshadow the consumer warning, well the consumer warning says you have 30 days [41:58.840 --> 42:06.480] to dispute this letter that they sent, 30 days, so when you get a letter and it says [42:06.480 --> 42:12.480] contact this office right away, call this office to make arrangements to make payments, [42:12.480 --> 42:18.080] contact this office in 10 days, that's overshadowing, it's a violation of the Debt Collection Practices [42:18.080 --> 42:25.320] Act, it's already on the federal books, there's case law on it, tech wiki out of the state [42:25.320 --> 42:31.080] of Wisconsin and federal court up there, these are federal court cases, the judges up there [42:31.080 --> 42:36.400] determine that that's overshadowing, a debt collector did that there, it violates your [42:36.400 --> 42:44.680] civil rights, oh my gosh, really, yeah, that's the point I try to bring out when you're driving [42:44.680 --> 42:48.480] down the street, you're doing 50 and a 30 and the cops pull you over and give you a [42:48.480 --> 42:52.040] ticket and then they take out the nightstick and start beating the heck out of you, you [42:52.040 --> 42:56.360] can't do that, you're violating my civil rights, yeah, I might have deserved a ticket but I [42:56.360 --> 43:06.080] don't deserve a beating, so all this stuff is all pretty much in concrete, there's a [43:06.080 --> 43:11.920] lot of cases I'm working with right now, people around the country, I have another case in [43:11.920 --> 43:19.040] Florida, a gentleman out, he's working out of Jacksonville and then I have my good buddy [43:19.040 --> 43:23.880] Larry down in Orlando, Larry's a bigger pain in the butt than I am, he and I have probably [43:23.880 --> 43:30.440] been doing this around the same time, we're very, very close, he's got a case going on [43:30.440 --> 43:35.120] right now, he's not in any trouble but he just likes to stir the pot, I give him a lot [43:35.120 --> 43:36.120] of credit for that. [43:36.120 --> 43:42.480] Alright, hold on, we'll be right back, we're going to talk about your friend as soon as [43:42.480 --> 43:46.360] we get back on the other side, we'll open up the phone lines in just a little while [43:46.360 --> 44:00.240] folks, we're here with Michael Maris on Rule of Law Radio. [44:00.240 --> 44:05.320] Are you being harassed by debt collectors with phone calls, letters or even lawsuits? [44:05.320 --> 44:09.000] Stop debt collectors now with the Michael Maris Proven Method. [44:09.000 --> 44:13.320] Michael Maris has won six cases in federal court against debt collectors and now you [44:13.320 --> 44:14.320] can win two. [44:14.320 --> 44:19.160] You'll get step by step instructions in plain English on how to win in court using federal [44:19.160 --> 44:20.840] civil rights statutes. [44:20.840 --> 44:24.500] What to do when contacted by phone, mail or court summons. [44:24.500 --> 44:26.520] How to answer letters and phone calls. [44:26.520 --> 44:29.120] How to get debt collectors out of your credit report. [44:29.120 --> 44:33.760] How to turn the financial tables on them and make them pay you to go away. [44:33.760 --> 44:38.880] The Michael Maris Proven Method is the solution for how to stop debt collectors. [44:38.880 --> 44:41.040] Personal consultation is available as well. [44:41.040 --> 44:46.560] For more information, please visit ruleoflawradio.com and click on the blue Michael Maris banner [44:46.560 --> 44:49.560] or email michaelmaris at yahoo.com. [44:49.560 --> 44:57.240] That's ruleoflawradio.com or email m-i-c-h-a-e-l-m-i-r-r-a-s at yahoo.com. [44:57.240 --> 45:04.240] To learn how to stop debt collectors now. [45:27.240 --> 45:34.040] Okay, we're back with Mike Maris. [45:34.040 --> 45:35.040] Okay, Mike, go ahead. [45:35.040 --> 45:37.560] You're about to tell a story about your friend Larry. [45:37.560 --> 45:38.560] Right. [45:38.560 --> 45:45.800] Yeah, Larry's out of the Orlando area and like I said, he and I have known each other [45:45.800 --> 45:50.800] I would say six, seven years and he's pretty intensive and as I said, he's a bigger pain [45:50.800 --> 45:53.960] in the butt than I am when it comes to this stuff. [45:53.960 --> 45:58.440] We work together on numerous cases. [45:58.440 --> 46:04.000] One gentleman I have in Jackson Delaria has a case in federal court right now and of course [46:04.000 --> 46:05.000] he's proceeding on his own. [46:05.000 --> 46:10.600] He bought the course and then he hired me to come in and help him with the paperwork [46:10.600 --> 46:17.880] and so on and so forth and Larry's case is very, very interesting and I'm going to give [46:17.880 --> 46:22.360] you the coordination between the two of them. [46:22.360 --> 46:31.320] Larry filed as a plaintiff and all similarly situated individuals and right away everybody [46:31.320 --> 46:36.280] hears that and says, �Oh, this is class action.� No, it's not a class action. [46:36.280 --> 46:41.780] But there's a trick for doing that and why you do it. [46:41.780 --> 46:53.240] He has 26 defendants in the case, debt collectors, credit bureaus, banks, you name it. [46:53.240 --> 46:54.240] They're in this case. [46:54.240 --> 47:04.120] They're defendants in the case and when you say similarly situated individuals, it forces [47:04.120 --> 47:10.800] them when you go into discovery to open the books to see how many other people they've [47:10.800 --> 47:12.080] done this to. [47:12.080 --> 47:16.520] Yes, and we hear people talking about private attorney general. [47:16.520 --> 47:22.040] This is the only time that you can be a private attorney general. [47:22.040 --> 47:23.400] That's correct. [47:23.400 --> 47:28.040] That's correct and he has used that in the complaint and he's already told me, he says, [47:28.040 --> 47:31.920] �Mike, I've had six of the debt collectors already settle with me and I won't be able [47:31.920 --> 47:33.840] to tell you how much he's gotten already. [47:33.840 --> 47:34.840] Just go away. [47:34.840 --> 47:37.120] They don't want to go in that court.� [47:37.120 --> 47:47.120] The interesting part is my guy up in Jacksonville has this attorney on his case who's representing [47:47.120 --> 47:54.840] the defendant and the same defendant that Larry has in his case is the same attorney. [47:54.840 --> 47:59.480] I find that interesting. [47:59.480 --> 48:07.760] So now she has three of us against her. [48:07.760 --> 48:13.680] We also had a very big chuckle several years ago when Larry sued � actually I sued one [48:13.680 --> 48:20.800] of the credit bureaus and you can see that in face are the one I sued. [48:20.800 --> 48:24.600] Went through that whole process, wanted to learn what was involved. [48:24.600 --> 48:27.760] It's a whole different approach when you go after the bureaus. [48:27.760 --> 48:32.760] I haven't released that course yet, I'm going to do it, but I just don't want people to [48:32.760 --> 48:36.680] get jumpy and go in and start cleaning up their credit report because then they lose [48:36.680 --> 48:42.520] all the violations in that credit report against the creditors and debt collectors. [48:42.520 --> 48:49.320] Anyhow, sued this bureau and went through the whole process. [48:49.320 --> 48:50.920] I wanted to learn this. [48:50.920 --> 48:56.320] They had offered me several settlement offers during discovery. [48:56.320 --> 48:57.640] I wanted to be deposed. [48:57.640 --> 49:03.160] I was deposed by them for six hours because I wanted to learn the day of the deposition. [49:03.160 --> 49:07.880] They asked me if I would take X amount of dollars without going through the deposition. [49:07.880 --> 49:09.240] My response was quite simple. [49:09.240 --> 49:11.400] I said, �Well, gee, I don't know if that's a good price or not. [49:11.400 --> 49:15.840] I have to talk that over with my constituents and let's proceed.� That started at nine [49:15.840 --> 49:16.840] o'clock. [49:16.840 --> 49:21.520] We took an hour break from noon to one for lunch and I continued from one p.m. to four [49:21.520 --> 49:24.040] p.m. being deposed. [49:24.040 --> 49:27.480] So ask me if I know what it's like to be deposed in one of these cases. [49:27.480 --> 49:28.480] Hmm. [49:28.480 --> 49:29.480] Nobody shot me. [49:29.480 --> 49:32.480] It was just, you know, nobody hit me with anything. [49:32.480 --> 49:36.680] I just sat at a conference table, myself, the defendant's attorney and the stenographer. [49:36.680 --> 49:37.680] That was it. [49:37.680 --> 49:38.680] Not very intimidating. [49:38.680 --> 49:53.760] Anyway, about a year later, Larry, my buddy, goes after the same credit bureau. [49:53.760 --> 49:58.160] And guess what lawyer he gets? [49:58.160 --> 50:06.560] The same lawyer I had on my case is a big law firm out of Dallas, Fort Worth area. [50:06.560 --> 50:16.000] They have 15 offices around the world, Hong Kong, Netherlands, Mexico City, 240 attorneys [50:16.000 --> 50:19.600] on staff. [50:19.600 --> 50:23.040] I beat him. [50:23.040 --> 50:27.200] So ask me if I'm afraid to go up against attorneys. [50:27.200 --> 50:28.200] It's pretty interesting. [50:28.200 --> 50:32.280] And now Larry's got the same guy I had and of course we know everything they're going [50:32.280 --> 50:34.200] to do. [50:34.200 --> 50:37.800] We know everything they're going to do. [50:37.800 --> 50:45.920] And one of the things I told Larry and I always wanted to be the proverbial fly on the wall [50:45.920 --> 50:46.920] with this one. [50:46.920 --> 50:50.760] I told Larry that they used to settle with these guys and defeat the group. [50:50.760 --> 50:59.880] Do me a favor, turn around and wave at the lawyer and tell him Mike Maris says hello. [50:59.880 --> 51:00.880] And he did that. [51:00.880 --> 51:05.440] And the guy got real squinty eyed because it had been a year or two since I had messed [51:05.440 --> 51:06.440] with him. [51:06.440 --> 51:09.200] And he said, oh yeah, tell him I said hello too. [51:09.200 --> 51:14.440] Can you imagine what that lawyer was thinking after hearing that? [51:14.440 --> 51:16.800] What the heck is going on? [51:16.800 --> 51:24.720] Okay, well anyhow the bottom line is we're developing such a database across the country [51:24.720 --> 51:32.880] of different people with different cases and I'm in touch with them. [51:32.880 --> 51:37.360] There isn't any response that I have seen from any of these guys that I haven't seen [51:37.360 --> 51:39.440] before and we know how to answer. [51:39.440 --> 51:47.640] And the neat part is lawyers have attorney, lawyers have access to ACER but if they don't [51:47.640 --> 51:53.800] know what names to put in there to see the cases, how do they find the cases? [51:53.800 --> 51:59.080] I don't have that problem because I know who's running the cases and I know where they are [51:59.080 --> 52:00.920] and I have their names. [52:00.920 --> 52:04.980] Okay, so it gets pretty interesting. [52:04.980 --> 52:09.840] This whole thing is remarkably incredible. [52:09.840 --> 52:14.560] A lot of people out there are kicking butt and taking names and I'm very proud of a lot [52:14.560 --> 52:18.360] of these folks that are doing this stuff. [52:18.360 --> 52:22.800] Some folks, I've got to hold their hand a little bit more, they don't get it all but [52:22.800 --> 52:27.640] some of them are very, very sharp and they pick up on this stuff right away and two minute [52:27.640 --> 52:31.000] conversation and they know where to go. [52:31.000 --> 52:33.920] So Debbie, did you have a question for me? [52:33.920 --> 52:35.040] Yes, I did. [52:35.040 --> 52:42.960] I was wondering what a strategy would be, say for example there was a debt where the [52:42.960 --> 52:52.280] information of the debt gets sold to a third party creditor, debt collector and then nothing [52:52.280 --> 52:57.960] ever happens, they never actually file suit and then six months later they just sell it [52:57.960 --> 53:00.680] to the next third party debt collector. [53:00.680 --> 53:07.640] How would you deal with a situation like that as far as do you have to backtrack through [53:07.640 --> 53:13.240] all these different debt collectors to get your credit report eventually cleaned up? [53:13.240 --> 53:17.520] Do you have to sue all the debt collectors or how would that work? [53:17.520 --> 53:19.880] Well there's a couple of ways you can do it. [53:19.880 --> 53:24.120] Actually the first way you're talking about would probably be the most prosperous for [53:24.120 --> 53:30.480] you is sue each one of them individually and make them pay to go away. [53:30.480 --> 53:34.560] You want to stop the current one and once you stop the current one and you get it in [53:34.560 --> 53:39.720] writing that you're not going to sell this now or in the future, that kind of stops it [53:39.720 --> 53:43.620] right there but you still got these other guys in your credit report. [53:43.620 --> 53:47.880] So you send them the validation letter and they better fix the problem. [53:47.880 --> 53:50.360] If they sold it, oh that's good. [53:50.360 --> 53:55.080] I'm disputing the account with you, why haven't you marked my account in dispute? [53:55.080 --> 54:01.840] But there's a third way of doing this which is pretty effective is when you go after the [54:01.840 --> 54:07.520] debt collector that's after you now, you go after the original creditor at the same time [54:07.520 --> 54:12.040] you name the original creditor the co-defendant. [54:12.040 --> 54:20.280] Do you think the original creditor has any influence with the debt collectors? [54:20.280 --> 54:25.360] Probably not much if they've sold it already. [54:25.360 --> 54:36.200] Well whether you know it or not the debt collection business is a $75 billion a year business [54:36.200 --> 54:45.480] and if I'm ABC debt collector and I'm collecting for XYZ bank and I just caused that bank to [54:45.480 --> 54:52.480] get called into a lawsuit, how many more of those debts do you think that bank's going [54:52.480 --> 54:59.960] to give that debt collector to collect on? [54:59.960 --> 55:01.480] What you've got to sued? [55:01.480 --> 55:04.040] We might have to have people be deposed? [55:04.040 --> 55:07.960] Well you know how could you let this happen? [55:07.960 --> 55:11.000] You know we don't want to be involved with this thing. [55:11.000 --> 55:16.880] Bottom line is the creditor has the ability, you know, think about this, you bought this [55:16.880 --> 55:22.080] thing for a hundred bucks, you bought it from the bank, bank closed up saying we want all [55:22.080 --> 55:30.040] them back and you're, the bank is your customer and you're going to tell them no, right? [55:30.040 --> 55:34.280] We're not going to get them back. [55:34.280 --> 55:39.080] I don't think that's going to happen. [55:39.080 --> 55:44.160] If it did, it's no problem, we'll go after each one of the debt collectors separately. [55:44.160 --> 55:46.160] Easy. [55:46.160 --> 55:49.040] Debt collectors don't want to go in that courtroom. [55:49.040 --> 55:54.680] Because isn't this whole thing illegal anyway? [55:54.680 --> 55:55.680] I mean... [55:55.680 --> 56:02.320] Well, you know, it's just a scam, you know, if you get into the details of this stuff, [56:02.320 --> 56:07.620] you know, these accounts are written off, the creditor writes them off, number one they [56:07.620 --> 56:17.560] have insurance for it, you don't have to believe me at all. [56:17.560 --> 56:22.560] Remember a few months ago here we had this big company called AIG that we bailed out [56:22.560 --> 56:37.320] for a hundred and eighty billion dollars for insuring bad notes, hmm, interesting, interesting. [56:37.320 --> 56:42.680] There were investors on the stock market, 60 Minutes had a very interesting program [56:42.680 --> 56:50.200] on this back in, I believe it was August, the last Sunday in August of last year, called [56:50.200 --> 56:56.000] Financial Weapons of Mass Destruction, it was called, it talked about these investors [56:56.000 --> 57:03.740] who bought insurance, anybody could bet on these bad mortgages and they bought insurance [57:03.740 --> 57:10.680] on them and the insurance didn't cost much, whole thing, whole thing, that these notes [57:10.680 --> 57:15.600] would go bad and the insurance companies would have to pay them off, and guess what folks, [57:15.600 --> 57:22.400] that's exactly what happened, exactly what happened, they made billions these guys, 60 [57:22.400 --> 57:28.440] Minutes tried to get them on TV to talk to them, they wouldn't come on TV, they had a [57:28.440 --> 57:35.920] lot of law experts, professors from the law schools talking about this, they had the former [57:35.920 --> 57:41.840] insurance, whatever they call them, superintendent of the state of New York talking about this [57:41.840 --> 57:47.720] who's gambling, who's gambling, and he explained it very, very simple, you go and bet on a [57:47.720 --> 57:53.240] team, you don't own the team, you don't own the basketball team, you don't own the football [57:53.240 --> 57:59.640] team, but you can place a bet, and if they win you get paid off, this is what they were [57:59.640 --> 58:11.000] doing with these bad notes, wow, they knew they were going to go bad, yeah, it's like, [58:11.000 --> 58:17.800] you know the outcome beforehand and then you bet on the loser, alright well listen, Mike [58:17.800 --> 58:21.880] would you like to start taking some calls after the next break, after this break, sure, [58:21.880 --> 58:25.840] okay we're going to open up the phone lines now, folks if you have a question for Michael [58:25.840 --> 58:35.200] Mears, 512-646-1984, I just opened up the phone lines, it's 512-646-1984, if you have [58:35.200 --> 59:00.240] a question for us or Michael Mears, we'll be right back. [59:00.240 --> 59:05.680] My name is Randall Kelton and I co-host on Rule of Law Radio, we specialize in showing [59:05.680 --> 59:10.440] people how to strike back against corrupt public officials, with the mortgage crisis [59:10.440 --> 59:14.720] worsening, we set our sights on finding a remedy for people who have been cheated by [59:14.720 --> 59:19.700] their lenders, if you have a mortgage or have paid yours off, you have probably been cheated [59:19.700 --> 59:26.440] out of thousands, but there is a remedy, go to remediesinrealestate.com or call me at [59:26.440 --> 59:34.560] 512-430-4140 and find out how to use the consumer protection laws to recover what the lenders [59:34.560 --> 59:40.040] have stolen through fraud and deception, we will prepare for you a qualified written request [59:40.040 --> 59:45.340] that will expose the fraud and put the lenders on the dime, lender fraud is bankrupting this [59:45.340 --> 59:55.200] country and it's time to fight back, go to remediesinrealestate.com or call 512-430-4140 [59:55.200 --> 59:59.600] and get the information you need to stop the money changers in their tracks. [59:59.600 --> 01:00:04.560] This news brief brought to you by the International Newsnet. [01:00:04.560 --> 01:00:10.000] Giving the administration another potential excuse to stall the U.S. pullout from Iraq, [01:00:10.000 --> 01:00:15.800] officials are now warning that the Asab al-Haq, League of the Righteous, an anti-U.S. Shiite [01:00:15.800 --> 01:00:20.560] militia intends to attack the Green Zone and other U.S. bases. [01:00:20.560 --> 01:00:25.640] Barack Obama's advisors will likely recommend Khalid Sheikh Mohammed, the self-proclaimed [01:00:25.640 --> 01:00:31.720] mastermind of 9-11, be prosecuted in a military tribunal, reversing Attorney General Eric [01:00:31.720 --> 01:00:35.000] Holder's plan to try him in civilian court. [01:00:35.000 --> 01:00:39.600] If Obama accepts his advisor's recommendation, the White House may be able to secure from [01:00:39.600 --> 01:00:45.280] Congress the funding and legal authority needed to close the Guantanamo prison and replace [01:00:45.280 --> 01:00:47.080] it with a facility in the U.S. [01:00:47.080 --> 01:00:54.400] Top of the hour news brought to you by INN World Report. [01:00:54.400 --> 01:00:59.640] Signs emerged that Pentagon subway shooter John Patrick Baddell harbored strong hatred [01:00:59.640 --> 01:01:05.440] toward the U.S. government and the armed forces and questioned the official version of 9-11. [01:01:05.440 --> 01:01:10.400] Baddell was shot and killed Thursday in an exchange of fire at the entrance to the Pentagon [01:01:10.400 --> 01:01:13.480] station subway in Washington, D.C. [01:01:13.480 --> 01:01:18.880] Baddell left several Internet postings under the username jpatrickbaddell, saying he was [01:01:18.880 --> 01:01:24.920] determined to see that justice is served in the death of Marine Colonel James Sabo, who [01:01:24.920 --> 01:01:29.800] was found dead in the backyard of his California home in 1991. [01:01:29.800 --> 01:01:34.920] The death was ruled a suicide, but Sabo's family maintains he was murdered because he [01:01:34.920 --> 01:01:40.760] was about to expose covert military operations in Central America involving drug smuggling. [01:01:40.760 --> 01:01:46.240] Baddell said the Sabo case was a step toward establishing the truth of events such as the [01:01:46.240 --> 01:01:50.520] September 11th demolitions. [01:01:50.520 --> 01:01:56.200] Senate Armed Services Committee Chairman Carl Levin says the Pentagon should consider Blackwater's [01:01:56.200 --> 01:02:03.080] past, quote, deficiencies in deciding whether to award a $1 billion contract to train Afghan [01:02:03.080 --> 01:02:04.720] national police. [01:02:04.720 --> 01:02:10.520] Levin wrote Defense Secretary Robert Gates, quote, incidents in Iraq led many to conclude [01:02:10.520 --> 01:02:15.440] that Blackwater was not a suitable contracting partner for the U.S. government and contributed [01:02:15.440 --> 01:02:21.120] to the company's decision to change its name, adding the inadequacies in Blackwater's performance [01:02:21.120 --> 01:02:26.520] appear to have contributed to a shooting incident that had undermined our mission in Afghanistan. [01:02:26.520 --> 01:02:31.680] Levin also said the firm may have misappropriated government weapons and carried arms without [01:02:31.680 --> 01:02:33.040] authorization. [01:02:33.040 --> 01:02:39.240] Blackwater guards have been accused of murdering 17 Iraqi citizens in cold blood in 2007. [01:02:39.240 --> 01:02:45.040] In January, two U.S. security contractors working for ParaVent, a unit of Z, formerly [01:02:45.040 --> 01:03:13.400] Blackwater, were arrested on charges they murdered two Afghans in Kabul. [01:03:15.040 --> 01:03:39.760] All right, we are here with our very special guest, Michael Mears, talking about how to [01:03:39.760 --> 01:03:43.800] stop these rogue debt collectors. [01:03:43.800 --> 01:03:47.920] We do have a caller, Janice, from Texas, Janice, just hold on, Mike wanted to finish up on [01:03:47.920 --> 01:03:52.040] his train of thought before we went to break, go ahead, Michael. [01:03:52.040 --> 01:03:58.320] So anyhow, we're basically talking about financial weapons of mass destruction, as CBS called [01:03:58.320 --> 01:04:06.640] it on 60 Minutes back at the end of August 2009, and how these investors invested in [01:04:06.640 --> 01:04:11.840] these bad notes and got paid by the insurance companies. [01:04:11.840 --> 01:04:19.720] And very fascinating program to watch, and if you see this and you learn what happens [01:04:19.720 --> 01:04:22.320] and how it happened, you will be furious. [01:04:22.320 --> 01:04:28.960] I saw that program and I said, I am totally justified in everything I'm doing here today, [01:04:28.960 --> 01:04:32.960] and I know who I'm dealing with. [01:04:32.960 --> 01:04:38.920] We're talking briefly about, you asked me about when they don't loan money or anything [01:04:38.920 --> 01:04:41.760] like that, that's correct, that's a true statement. [01:04:41.760 --> 01:04:47.600] You're the money, without you signing the note, without them presenting the note, they [01:04:47.600 --> 01:04:51.680] don't get money from the feds, etc. [01:04:51.680 --> 01:04:56.760] Don't have to believe me, because if banks have money, I think we just bailed them out [01:04:56.760 --> 01:05:00.560] a few months ago, if they got money, how come we had to bail them out, that's because they [01:05:00.560 --> 01:05:01.560] don't have money. [01:05:01.560 --> 01:05:03.600] You're the money, the people are the money. [01:05:03.600 --> 01:05:08.480] Your note, your piece of paper, the little credit card slip you signed, that's the money [01:05:08.480 --> 01:05:12.400] folks, and you generate. [01:05:12.400 --> 01:05:17.080] So that's where the money comes from, but the point is, when these cases, when these [01:05:17.080 --> 01:05:22.320] accounts go south, they're insured, a lot of times they're insured for this stuff, and [01:05:22.320 --> 01:05:26.920] they get paid by the insurance company. [01:05:26.920 --> 01:05:31.760] And then they sell it to the debt collector who's got a note that's due, or a debt that's [01:05:31.760 --> 01:05:37.960] due with zero balance on it, that the bank got paid for it, buys it for a hundred bucks [01:05:37.960 --> 01:05:43.160] and turns around and goes right back up to the original amount, plus adds interest, late [01:05:43.160 --> 01:05:47.240] charges, and if there's an attorney involved, attorney speaks. [01:05:47.240 --> 01:05:49.840] What a scam, what a scam. [01:05:49.840 --> 01:05:55.200] And if they don't have insurance on those original accounts, guess what folks, they [01:05:55.200 --> 01:06:01.920] get to write it off their income tax as a business law, so they get an income tax credit [01:06:01.920 --> 01:06:02.920] for it. [01:06:02.920 --> 01:06:04.400] What do you want from me? [01:06:04.400 --> 01:06:08.480] Okay, I mean, this is just the stuff that goes on. [01:06:08.480 --> 01:06:14.240] And so I have very little pity for these guys, and I think most of the lawyers I've been [01:06:14.240 --> 01:06:20.120] up against, they know this, they know this stuff, and you know, unless you're asking [01:06:20.120 --> 01:06:23.520] for a million bucks, they're not going to fight you too hard. [01:06:23.520 --> 01:06:28.680] My own personal opinion, they'll sometimes put up a little defense and go back and forth [01:06:28.680 --> 01:06:34.160] and you'll get into 26F discovery, but once you get into discovery, you start asking the [01:06:34.160 --> 01:06:35.160] pointed questions. [01:06:35.160 --> 01:06:39.600] That clears all the mud out of the water, and then all of a sudden they see that you've [01:06:39.600 --> 01:06:40.600] got them. [01:06:40.600 --> 01:06:42.600] It's time to settle. [01:06:42.600 --> 01:06:45.640] Okay, Deb, go ahead, put the caller on. [01:06:45.640 --> 01:06:48.080] Okay, we have a caller here. [01:06:48.080 --> 01:06:50.200] We've got Janice from Texas. [01:06:50.200 --> 01:06:51.200] Thanks, Janice. [01:06:51.200 --> 01:06:53.040] What's on your mind tonight? [01:06:53.040 --> 01:07:05.920] Well, a little while back, I had gotten in touch with DirecTV, getting a cable, not cable [01:07:05.920 --> 01:07:14.000] but satellite, and I had called a lady and they had sent out a bunch of pamphlets about, [01:07:14.000 --> 01:07:22.280] oh, for $29 you can have this, 150 channels, and for $39 you can have over 200 and something [01:07:22.280 --> 01:07:30.280] channels and all this stuff, and so I really needed to save on my expenses, so I said I [01:07:30.280 --> 01:07:37.360] would try it, but I told them, I told the lady I would absolutely not agree to a contract. [01:07:37.360 --> 01:07:43.040] Oh, no problem, you have any problem, you just send it all back, no problem at all, [01:07:43.040 --> 01:07:44.040] blah, blah, blah. [01:07:44.040 --> 01:07:53.880] Well, in total, it will only cost you like $46 or $56 for the whole thing, and so I said [01:07:53.880 --> 01:07:54.880] I would try it. [01:07:54.880 --> 01:08:06.360] Well, no sooner had the man gotten there to start setting everything up, all these different [01:08:06.360 --> 01:08:08.240] things are going on. [01:08:08.240 --> 01:08:13.400] After promising me there was no contract, suddenly it's supposed to be a two-year contract [01:08:13.400 --> 01:08:22.160] and the bill that was promised to be $59.99 a month turned out to be $90.88, and then [01:08:22.160 --> 01:08:30.360] they want, I wanted my TV to work with TiVo, all of a sudden, nope, they can't do that, [01:08:30.360 --> 01:08:36.480] and then the installation of the TiVo and Internet, they had promised that they were [01:08:36.480 --> 01:08:43.120] going to do the Internet as well as the TV and everything, and we're talking about putting [01:08:43.120 --> 01:08:44.120] it all together. [01:08:44.120 --> 01:08:49.920] Well, I'm trying to talk to these people for hours on the phone, and they keep switching [01:08:49.920 --> 01:08:52.360] from this place to that place to this place. [01:08:52.360 --> 01:08:57.200] They can't give me a total because it's with a different company. [01:08:57.200 --> 01:09:05.880] He shuts my TV cable off, Internet, he shuts that off, and he's not giving me that, but [01:09:05.880 --> 01:09:13.080] he shuts it off, and I'm sitting there now with no Internet, and you know, I'm sitting [01:09:13.080 --> 01:09:18.600] there arguing with them for hours and hours and hours, and my ears are burning from talking [01:09:18.600 --> 01:09:23.960] so long, and then the man comes in and says, got to go, I got to get to the next one, you [01:09:23.960 --> 01:09:28.160] know, and everything, and Walt is out of there, doesn't even show us how to set anything up [01:09:28.160 --> 01:09:38.720] or anything, and I'm finding out all of these other things, about $90 instead of the $59 [01:09:38.720 --> 01:09:44.520] and everything, and I kept telling them, no, I didn't agree to that, that's not the agreement, [01:09:44.520 --> 01:09:48.280] and they said, I don't care what the other lady said, doesn't matter what the other lady [01:09:48.280 --> 01:09:52.720] said, you've got no proof of that, that was all on the phone, blah, blah, blah, and yet [01:09:52.720 --> 01:09:57.000] they're saying I'm under contract. [01:09:57.000 --> 01:10:05.520] So in results, they finally came down on the price after I refused to budge on the monthly [01:10:05.520 --> 01:10:15.640] and everything, but then they charged me $900 total on my MasterCard for what was supposed [01:10:15.640 --> 01:10:22.800] to have been $20 just to start the process, and everything. [01:10:22.800 --> 01:10:27.680] I didn't even think about the fact that they had my MasterCard, or I would have gotten [01:10:27.680 --> 01:10:32.400] along with them a little bit better, but I was just so mad about all the lies, just one [01:10:32.400 --> 01:10:42.800] thing after another, and everything, and they kept a lot of that money. [01:10:42.800 --> 01:10:45.800] So that's where I am. [01:10:45.800 --> 01:10:51.240] They kept a lot of my money, and the MasterCard got them to take some of it back, after I [01:10:51.240 --> 01:10:56.880] sent everything back to them and everything, all of the equipment, but they still have [01:10:56.880 --> 01:11:00.240] kept over $400 and something. [01:11:00.240 --> 01:11:05.120] So I assume you disputed with your credit card holder. [01:11:05.120 --> 01:11:15.140] I disputed with my credit card holder and everything, but these people haven't made [01:11:15.140 --> 01:11:17.000] it right. [01:11:17.000 --> 01:11:24.680] Okay, so a couple of quick questions, are they in your credit report, do they have a [01:11:24.680 --> 01:11:27.760] debt collector after you, or what? [01:11:27.760 --> 01:11:33.160] Well they were sending me a lot of bills for a long time, and I kept arguing with the people [01:11:33.160 --> 01:11:41.360] calling me that they were lying to me, and at first they were saying, ah, prove it, prove [01:11:41.360 --> 01:11:42.360] it, prove it. [01:11:42.360 --> 01:11:44.360] Well are they in your credit report, have you checked your credit report? [01:11:44.360 --> 01:11:50.400] I have not checked my credit report, I've never gone on there. [01:11:50.400 --> 01:12:00.200] Yeah, because generally, the satellite DISH companies now, I had DirecTV once, once and [01:12:00.200 --> 01:12:06.680] one time only, I've always dealt with DISH, and DISH has been, I can't speak well enough [01:12:06.680 --> 01:12:12.480] of them, they're very, very good, their installers are very good, I've had no issues or problems [01:12:12.480 --> 01:12:17.400] with them, but I had an opportunity at one time to get a package with phone service and [01:12:17.400 --> 01:12:25.560] so I switched a bit over to DirecTV, it took them four trips to get my wireless connections [01:12:25.560 --> 01:12:30.080] hooked up with the extra TV and apps, they didn't know what they were doing. [01:12:30.080 --> 01:12:38.000] I couldn't wait to get rid of them, and I will not deal with DirecTV, but anyhow DISH [01:12:38.000 --> 01:12:45.720] is my preferred service, I've had it probably since, I'm going to say 2000 or so when they [01:12:45.720 --> 01:12:57.240] first came out, so I've had them for almost ten years, but anyhow, you have some recourse, [01:12:57.240 --> 01:13:06.480] they owe you money, and I had a very interesting situation with a telephone company here, a [01:13:06.480 --> 01:13:11.760] year and a half ago, on a wireless device, similar situation to what you've just gone [01:13:11.760 --> 01:13:17.600] through, and I bought one of these little plug-in wireless devices from my laptop and [01:13:17.600 --> 01:13:25.920] it didn't work, and the reason it didn't work is the telephone company that provided it, [01:13:25.920 --> 01:13:32.640] and it's the biggest telephone company out here in the west, they're headquartered out [01:13:32.640 --> 01:13:37.040] of Denver, I'm not going to give their name because I do have a confidentiality agreement [01:13:37.040 --> 01:13:44.240] with them. They charged me $55, $52.99 for the device, and I paid for it, I took it home, [01:13:44.240 --> 01:13:48.800] it didn't work, I contacted them, oh we're going to send you a UPS box to send it back, [01:13:48.800 --> 01:13:55.200] okay great, send me the UPS box, I sent it back to them, I kept the tracking number and [01:13:55.200 --> 01:13:59.760] everything, I know when they got it, called them up a week or so later after they got [01:13:59.760 --> 01:14:06.960] it, oh yeah we got it, we're working on getting you your refund, that was just $52.99, I'm [01:14:06.960 --> 01:14:13.160] sorry, a year later I don't have the refund. I finally am hooked up with their people in [01:14:13.160 --> 01:14:17.800] Denver and their corporate headquarters and the guy says well we don't have that in our [01:14:17.800 --> 01:14:22.640] records, I said well I paid with it with my credit card at your kiosk in the mall where [01:14:22.640 --> 01:14:30.720] I bought it, you know I can produce the credit card records, and okay so I sent him the credit [01:14:30.720 --> 01:14:35.680] card record, sure enough there it is, black and white, I paid the $52.99, nothing, the [01:14:35.680 --> 01:14:42.480] guy didn't even respond back to me, we're doing emails, I says okay boys, I got to get [01:14:42.480 --> 01:14:48.200] your attention and you're dealing with a guy that knows how to get your attention, so what [01:14:48.200 --> 01:14:54.760] did Mike do, Mike goes down to his little local courthouse and goes into the small claims [01:14:54.760 --> 01:15:03.160] office there, small claims court files a complaint, $65 to file it and then I had to have them [01:15:03.160 --> 01:15:13.360] served, cost me another $65 to have them served, explained in the complaint what was going [01:15:13.360 --> 01:15:20.640] on, why they owed me this refund, etc., etc., they get served, 24 hours after they get served [01:15:20.640 --> 01:15:24.920] I get a call from somebody in their corporate head or hey we just headquarters, they just [01:15:24.920 --> 01:15:30.280] hey we got your complaint and we'd like to resolve this, Mr. Maris if we give you back [01:15:30.280 --> 01:15:35.680] your refund and everything will you dismiss the case with prejudice, I says yeah I says [01:15:35.680 --> 01:15:42.680] but you know I've got $65 in court costs and process or oh we'll give you that, so they [01:15:42.680 --> 01:15:54.160] took the $52.99 and ran the bill up to $185 over a refund and I asked the lady that was [01:15:54.160 --> 01:15:58.960] on if I said you know I got to ask you one question because I don't understand why you [01:15:58.960 --> 01:16:05.760] would go through this over $52.99, I had the receipts, I had proof, I gave you back the [01:16:05.760 --> 01:16:14.120] unit, it wasn't broken, original boxes, everything, her answer to me was Mr. Maris we just don't [01:16:14.120 --> 01:16:22.840] have the systems in place to generate the refund, okay, she says to me will you dismiss [01:16:22.840 --> 01:16:28.880] the case, ma'am I'll dismiss the case with prejudice as soon as I get your check, two [01:16:28.880 --> 01:16:34.600] days later the check was in my mailbox and I went down and dismissed but I got my money [01:16:34.600 --> 01:16:47.720] back, okay, we're going to break Janice do you have more questions, I was just trying [01:16:47.720 --> 01:16:53.440] to find out if that's what I do is go to Small Plains, yeah, okay very good we'll be right [01:16:53.440 --> 01:17:02.200] back on the other side with Michael Maris, 512-646-1984, hello Austin my name is Harlan [01:17:02.200 --> 01:17:07.200] Deidre owner of Brave New Books a local independent bookstore here in town, many of you are familiar [01:17:07.200 --> 01:17:11.080] with the bookstore and have attended some of our events, we've been proud to host speakers [01:17:11.080 --> 01:17:16.040] like Alex Jones, Ron Paul, Jim Mars, Katherine Albert, Webster Carpley, G. Edward Griffin [01:17:16.040 --> 01:17:20.600] and many other heroic figures in the patriot movement but now Brave New Books needs your [01:17:20.600 --> 01:17:25.160] help in order to continue to provide a space for these events and be an outlet for hard [01:17:25.160 --> 01:17:30.320] to find materials, we're going to need you Austin to help spread the word about the bookstore, [01:17:30.320 --> 01:17:34.240] please tell your friends and family about the wide variety of materials we offer, we [01:17:34.240 --> 01:17:39.560] also have DVD duplication capabilities for all you activists, also if you haven't visited [01:17:39.560 --> 01:17:44.120] us yet please come down and show your support, it is so easy to support the big corporate [01:17:44.120 --> 01:17:48.960] chain stores that do nothing to further our message, remember you vote with your dollars, [01:17:48.960 --> 01:17:55.000] we're counting on you Austin, if you need any information please call 512-480-2503 or [01:17:55.000 --> 01:18:24.840] visit us at 1904 Guadalupe Street, thank you everyone. [01:18:25.880 --> 01:18:33.800] I was blindsided but now I can see your plans You put the fear in my pocket [01:18:33.800 --> 01:18:40.840] Took the money from my hands Ain't gonna fool me with that same old trick again [01:18:40.840 --> 01:19:05.640] Ain't gonna fool me Ain't gonna drop me with that same old sucker punch [01:19:05.640 --> 01:19:13.480] I get it now but then I must have been out of love Back then you had room to move [01:19:13.480 --> 01:19:17.960] But now you're feeling the grunge Ain't gonna get me with that same old sucker punch [01:19:17.960 --> 01:19:28.360] Alright we are back folks with Michael Maris, callers if you'd like to call in 512-646-1984 [01:19:28.360 --> 01:19:36.840] And Michael okay I had another question, alright say for example well I have a friend right now [01:19:36.840 --> 01:19:43.560] who's about to buy your course because they're looking at some credit card issues themselves [01:19:43.560 --> 01:19:52.160] and turns out that well as I was saying earlier you've got a third party debt collector who [01:19:52.160 --> 01:20:00.680] apparently bought the debt or bought the information relating to the debt as Jeff Sudjik would clarify [01:20:00.680 --> 01:20:07.720] and then nothing ever happened it got disputed but nothing ever happened so then they sold it [01:20:07.720 --> 01:20:13.600] after six months and now there's another debt collector attempting to collect this debt now [01:20:13.600 --> 01:20:20.200] neither one of these third party debt collectors have gotten into this person's credit report [01:20:20.200 --> 01:20:30.440] Only the original creditor is in the credit report so what would the strategy be at this point [01:20:30.440 --> 01:20:33.880] and you were saying earlier that you don't advise people to clean up their credit report [01:20:33.880 --> 01:20:38.440] too quickly on these things because they're actually helping you so can you give us a little [01:20:38.440 --> 01:20:42.600] strategy for this situation and explain about the credit report [01:20:42.600 --> 01:20:47.920] When you're dealing with a debt collector okay that's the purpose of the validation letter [01:20:47.920 --> 01:20:53.280] to go out and tell me what this is all about or they'll send you a letter saying hey you [01:20:53.280 --> 01:20:57.720] know we're trying to collect this debt that was previously belonged to Bank of America [01:20:57.720 --> 01:21:07.160] or Citicard or Chase or whoever that one and you know we now own this and we want our money [01:21:07.160 --> 01:21:13.520] and well when you validate with the debt collector they have two things they must do one they [01:21:13.520 --> 01:21:22.760] must prove to you that you actually had this account and I go back to the old down there [01:21:22.760 --> 01:21:31.160] in Texas there you know on the grassy knoll in Dealey Plaza 63 I saw you standing up on [01:21:31.160 --> 01:21:35.560] that knoll I know you pulled the trigger on Kenny I know I saw you do what the heck does [01:21:35.560 --> 01:21:42.680] that mean where's the proof because I say it or put it down on a piece of paper it must [01:21:42.680 --> 01:21:48.480] be the truth right and that's how they do this stuff when they get these debts they [01:21:48.480 --> 01:21:55.200] very seldom have a lot of information they'll have your name your social your current address [01:21:55.200 --> 01:22:00.480] or previous address maybe your phone number that's basically how they get this stuff they [01:22:00.480 --> 01:22:06.960] don't have a lot of detail but then they'll come back with things like statements and [01:22:06.960 --> 01:22:11.640] stuff like that maybe you can get some of those and send them to you unfortunately statements [01:22:11.640 --> 01:22:18.960] are not proof of any debt either as a contract if you want to know what proof of alleged [01:22:18.960 --> 01:22:25.840] debt is very simple to find out they made a very good example of it there's a case called [01:22:25.840 --> 01:22:35.480] Spears versus Brennan out of Indiana out of the appellate court there and they explained [01:22:35.480 --> 01:22:41.760] very nicely what it takes to prove a debt the contract is not proof of a debt statements [01:22:41.760 --> 01:22:49.040] are not proof of any debt it's called a ledger accounting and what a ledger accounting is [01:22:49.040 --> 01:22:54.840] is from the day the account was open where did all the monies go the monies you paid [01:22:54.840 --> 01:23:01.640] in the monies you took out the interest that was charged late payments anything like that [01:23:01.640 --> 01:23:07.720] through today that's what it takes to prove a debt just because somebody says so on a [01:23:07.720 --> 01:23:15.440] piece of paper doesn't mean it's true that's why the contract and it's very simple to understand [01:23:15.440 --> 01:23:20.280] if you have a credit card and you've never used it and you had a contract for that credit [01:23:20.280 --> 01:23:28.440] card and it was never used what good is the contract it doesn't prove you spent any money [01:23:28.440 --> 01:23:35.040] or borrowed any money on the credit card that's what this case explains very very nicely the [01:23:35.040 --> 01:23:42.040] appellate court up there explained it very very nicely a ledger accounting so anyhow [01:23:42.040 --> 01:23:49.240] get back to your point in hand I would go after the creditor I would go after the debt [01:23:49.240 --> 01:23:53.200] collector of course with the letter of validation and if they're not your credit report that's [01:23:53.200 --> 01:23:59.120] okay because whoever they're claiming the original creditor is they're in your credit [01:23:59.120 --> 01:24:04.280] report you go after them you send them a dispute letter they're required to do some things [01:24:04.280 --> 01:24:09.400] mark the account in dispute prove to you you owe something they don't do it they don't [01:24:09.400 --> 01:24:14.760] have to because they're big multi-billion dollar corporations and folks if you really [01:24:14.760 --> 01:24:20.200] sit down and think why they don't do it you know it's very easy to understand take a bank [01:24:20.200 --> 01:24:31.680] like Citibank Debra how many credit card customers do you think Citibank has millions tens of [01:24:31.680 --> 01:24:39.040] millions at least let's say two million let's keep it conservative and let's say out of [01:24:39.040 --> 01:24:45.920] the ten out of the two million a year you they get ten percent of them who dispute or [01:24:45.920 --> 01:24:50.640] argue or you know or calling them up about issues and I think that's a low number so [01:24:50.640 --> 01:25:01.840] that's two hundred thousand people a year calling them now how many clerks do you think [01:25:01.840 --> 01:25:11.720] Citibank has on staff to answer all these phone calls probably not very many if any [01:25:11.720 --> 01:25:17.360] at all they outsource all these kinds of phone calls overseas well they do that but here's [01:25:17.360 --> 01:25:26.560] the problem okay you're dealing with an electronic system and what these clerks do basically [01:25:26.560 --> 01:25:32.840] they get a letter and they put the person's name in and they push a couple of buttons [01:25:32.840 --> 01:25:39.960] and spits out a letter and it goes out the mail and it's all done automatically because [01:25:39.960 --> 01:25:46.880] if you think about it if they have three hundred clerks doing this stuff they would need to [01:25:46.880 --> 01:25:52.780] hire three thousand to handle each one of these issues individually now you say okay [01:25:52.780 --> 01:25:58.080] three thousand people well yeah but you see you got to pay those people a salary you got [01:25:58.080 --> 01:26:05.040] to pay them benefits retirement and it affects their bottom line so what's the big deal we [01:26:05.040 --> 01:26:11.320] get you know a hundred people a year suing us it's easier to pay them people off than [01:26:11.320 --> 01:26:17.480] to hire three thousand more clerks to handle the real problem and have a human being involved [01:26:17.480 --> 01:26:25.200] with this stuff it's just cheaper and you no one can convince me that is how it works [01:26:25.200 --> 01:26:32.680] same with the credit bureaus it's all done electronically credit bureau does an investigation [01:26:32.680 --> 01:26:42.200] it's seven minutes the clerks they're instructed they have to do ten or eight or whatever the [01:26:42.200 --> 01:26:47.640] number is an hour okay on these investigations well I don't know how much you can investigate [01:26:47.640 --> 01:26:55.360] six minutes on somebody so anyway the point is when you go after these guys you go after [01:26:55.360 --> 01:27:00.240] the debt collector you get them and then you go after the creditor and you bring them both [01:27:00.240 --> 01:27:05.440] into the same lawsuit and it's really simple the creditor would be the co-defendant and [01:27:05.440 --> 01:27:10.320] we go back to the situation that the debt collector is going to be very very concerned [01:27:10.320 --> 01:27:15.360] because you've got his customer in to a federal courtroom and you're suing them and it's making [01:27:15.360 --> 01:27:23.000] the debt collector look incompetent careless and you're the company who's in there as the [01:27:23.000 --> 01:27:29.080] co-defendant who's giving them these accounts and I know if something like that happened [01:27:29.080 --> 01:27:34.720] to me somebody I hired or gave stuff to to do business with and they got me involved [01:27:34.720 --> 01:27:39.280] with a lawsuit I'd be pretty reluctant on giving them any future business so the first [01:27:39.280 --> 01:27:43.760] step would be to send this validation letter to both the original creditor and the debt [01:27:43.760 --> 01:27:50.280] collector well you send a validation letter to the debt collector there is a difference [01:27:50.280 --> 01:27:55.640] you don't validate with the creditor a creditor doesn't have to answer a validation letter [01:27:55.640 --> 01:28:03.600] okay okay a debt collector has to answer a validation letter I don't know who you are [01:28:03.600 --> 01:28:08.440] I've never done business with you before and you know you need to prove to me I owe this [01:28:08.440 --> 01:28:13.960] thing under sworn you know penalty of perjury under oath type of stuff and got the limited [01:28:13.960 --> 01:28:18.600] cease and desist in there and gee I hope we can settle this aim and complete thank you [01:28:18.600 --> 01:28:25.840] sign it send it off to them the creditor and the debt and the credit euros are very very [01:28:25.840 --> 01:28:32.960] simple it's just a dispute letter your name your address I recently pulled my credit report [01:28:32.960 --> 01:28:37.200] I know you've noticed you're reporting erroneous and inaccurate information to my credit report [01:28:37.200 --> 01:28:42.080] I dispute it and you don't even have to get that specific with them you just got to say [01:28:42.080 --> 01:28:48.000] hey you're in my credit report I dispute this item sign it send it to them it's that simple [01:28:48.000 --> 01:28:55.920] because at that point they've been put on notice we've got a problem here we need to [01:28:55.920 --> 01:29:02.840] look at this and then of course they'll come back a lot of times and say to you yeah we [01:29:02.840 --> 01:29:10.160] got your letter of dispute but we need more information we need the 16th digit account [01:29:10.160 --> 01:29:16.400] number and your social security number please provide that we'll continue our investigation [01:29:16.400 --> 01:29:33.000] you're in my credit report and you don't know who I am is that right Mr. Creditor get [01:29:33.000 --> 01:29:39.360] that one to fly with the judge and jury very well okay and we have a caller on the line [01:29:39.360 --> 01:29:44.760] Tony from Illinois so we'll be going to the calls on the other side this is the rule of [01:29:44.760 --> 01:30:00.400] law we're with our very special guest Michael Maris we'll be right back [01:30:00.400 --> 01:30:05.760] are you the plaintiff or defendant in a lawsuit win your case without an attorney with Juris [01:30:05.760 --> 01:30:12.560] Dictionary the affordable easy to understand for CD course that will show you how in 24 [01:30:12.560 --> 01:30:19.000] hours step by step if you have a lawyer know what your lawyer should be doing if you don't [01:30:19.000 --> 01:30:23.960] have a lawyer know what you should do for yourself thousands have won with our step [01:30:23.960 --> 01:30:31.320] by step course and now you can too Juris Dictionary was created by a licensed attorney with 22 [01:30:31.320 --> 01:30:36.880] years of case winning experience even if you're not in a lawsuit you can learn what everyone [01:30:36.880 --> 01:30:42.680] should understand about the principles and practices that control our American courts [01:30:42.680 --> 01:30:50.280] you'll receive our audio classroom video seminar tutorials forms for civil cases pro se tactics [01:30:50.280 --> 01:30:56.720] and much more please visit ruleoflawradio.com and click on the banner or call toll free [01:30:56.720 --> 01:31:25.960] 866-LAW-EASY [01:31:25.960 --> 01:31:42.320] all right we are taking your calls we've got Tony from Illinois and Mark from Wisconsin [01:31:42.320 --> 01:31:46.440] Mark just hang on Tony was first he's been waiting for a few minutes Tony thanks for [01:31:46.440 --> 01:31:51.040] calling in what's your question for our guest actually I don't really have a question it's [01:31:51.040 --> 01:31:56.580] been a while since I've read up on this sort of thing but there are so many violations [01:31:56.580 --> 01:32:02.400] you can get against these third-party collection agencies there's so many laws protecting [01:32:02.400 --> 01:32:08.600] you not just federal but state for example I think federal law you they can't call you [01:32:08.600 --> 01:32:15.480] after nine isn't that correct that's correct some states though I believe they can't call [01:32:15.480 --> 01:32:22.720] you up to seven sure and I think there might be a few states where they can't talk to your [01:32:22.720 --> 01:32:34.800] spouse yeah and well you see the thing is my friend you want them to call you pardon [01:32:34.800 --> 01:32:42.160] I know that sounds crazy what's that you want them to call you and I know that sounds crazy [01:32:42.160 --> 01:32:46.200] getting at that was you know a lot of people are afraid to talk to the collection agency [01:32:46.200 --> 01:32:50.080] you should be eager to talk to them and record the call because there's so many ways that [01:32:50.080 --> 01:32:57.840] they screw up well in my course I give you 18 questions to ask them and they're rather [01:32:57.840 --> 01:33:02.280] simple when they call up you know you ask them you know what's their name what's the [01:33:02.280 --> 01:33:07.600] name of the company they're collecting for what's the address what's the phone number [01:33:07.600 --> 01:33:12.440] what's the name of the original creditor what's their address what's their phone number when [01:33:12.440 --> 01:33:17.840] you get down the 18th question this is usually the killer question and what is your social [01:33:17.840 --> 01:33:24.080] security number well I'm not going to give you that but you don't have to have that oh [01:33:24.080 --> 01:33:29.320] yes I do I don't know who I'm talking to you could be anybody I'm entitled to full disclosure [01:33:29.320 --> 01:33:36.880] what is your social security number well I'm not going to give that to you oh really okay [01:33:36.880 --> 01:33:43.720] well unfortunately I don't talk to non-entities and hang up on them now what do you think [01:33:43.720 --> 01:33:50.680] happens well sometimes they'll screw up and call you right back that's right that's what [01:33:50.680 --> 01:33:55.240] you want them to do and then they forget to give you the mini Miranda warning now this [01:33:55.240 --> 01:34:00.400] is an attempt to collect the debt every time they call you they must do that now that's [01:34:00.400 --> 01:34:05.560] only in certain states if I'm not mistaken that may be 10 well my friend here's what [01:34:05.560 --> 01:34:11.880] is that's where your thinking is wrong under Fair Debt Collection Practices Act they must [01:34:11.880 --> 01:34:18.180] give you the warning every time they call you and here's my answer to your answer sir [01:34:18.180 --> 01:34:27.000] why don't we let the judge and jury decide when you get them in that federal court the [01:34:27.000 --> 01:34:33.880] other thing to this is when you send out the validation letter there's a limited cease [01:34:33.880 --> 01:34:41.680] and desist in there that says don't call me at home or at work only contact me by US mail [01:34:41.680 --> 01:34:48.240] make sure you put that phone number on that letter so they can call you will you please [01:34:48.240 --> 01:34:51.760] right now and I think if you tell them not to call your cell phone they can't call you [01:34:51.760 --> 01:34:58.680] either that's right that that's if it costs you money to receive the phone call they cannot [01:34:58.680 --> 01:35:03.320] call you on that number you're absolutely right you can rack up a ton of violations [01:35:03.320 --> 01:35:09.720] but here's the caveat just yours sorry not just your spouse in certain states but any [01:35:09.720 --> 01:35:18.920] any person if they if these collection fees give you give say your fellow employees more [01:35:18.920 --> 01:35:26.320] right just just your your their phone number if they say what the call is about that's [01:35:26.320 --> 01:35:34.320] another violation that's a big one too yeah absolutely you know the point is under the [01:35:34.320 --> 01:35:42.040] debt under the federal debt collection practices act if you read the law it's only one thousand [01:35:42.040 --> 01:35:51.920] dollars per case for violations so you can have ten violations on them for ten thousand [01:35:51.920 --> 01:35:56.440] dollars and file your complaint accordingly and the first thing they're going to come [01:35:56.440 --> 01:36:02.680] back to you and say oh you can't get ten thousand dollars because the law says it's only one [01:36:02.680 --> 01:36:09.160] thousand dollars per case really well you know what Mr. Attorney you might be right [01:36:09.160 --> 01:36:17.760] why don't we let the judge and jury decide let's go boy let's go in front of that jury [01:36:17.760 --> 01:36:22.080] that ain't got any credit reports how about the judge you think he's got a credit report [01:36:22.080 --> 01:36:27.120] you think maybe anybody on that jury might have had issues like this before they're not [01:36:27.120 --> 01:36:32.200] going to get much sympathy but I'm going to take it a step further I have a case right [01:36:32.200 --> 01:36:39.520] now that I'm working with a lady up in Arkansas on the lawyer answered back in the complaint [01:36:39.520 --> 01:36:46.560] motion to dismiss and how much couldn't understand all the violations this party that I'm working [01:36:46.560 --> 01:36:52.920] with got against the debt collector so she goes in and says I don't understand how you [01:36:52.920 --> 01:37:01.000] arrived at this you can only get one thousand dollars per violation under the debt collection [01:37:01.000 --> 01:37:06.480] practices act I says wait a minute let me read that one more time you can only get one [01:37:06.480 --> 01:37:14.760] thousand dollars and she put it in bold underline per violation under debt collection I almost [01:37:14.760 --> 01:37:23.040] fell out of the chair laughing are you kidding me it's one thousand per case and the lawyer [01:37:23.040 --> 01:37:31.200] puts in here we can get one thousand per violation I'll agree to that my that's right my my person [01:37:31.200 --> 01:37:39.240] went back and said hey we'll premise to that no problem yeah they do a great job shooting [01:37:39.240 --> 01:37:44.440] themselves in the foot you don't have to help them too much okay Brian and despite all these [01:37:44.440 --> 01:37:51.600] laws you know sometimes they'll call you names they'll be abusive and oh yeah sometimes they'll [01:37:51.600 --> 01:37:56.160] even threaten you with jail which is I mean that's the most ridiculous thing I mean you [01:37:56.160 --> 01:38:03.360] just got to get them get them on get them on tape and it's a it's a slam dunk oh yeah [01:38:03.360 --> 01:38:08.800] yeah yeah exactly and I I instruct everyone to have a recorder next to their phone if [01:38:08.800 --> 01:38:13.640] they're in trouble doing this on a regular basis the purpose of the recorder is not to [01:38:13.640 --> 01:38:18.760] be brought into into the courtroom because 99.9 percent of the time they're not going [01:38:18.760 --> 01:38:24.120] to let you bring a recorder in however the purpose of the recorder is that you can create [01:38:24.120 --> 01:38:30.380] a ledger or transcript very accurately from what's on that recording and that transcript [01:38:30.380 --> 01:38:34.920] can be submitted into the court as evidence and oh by the way court if you need more proof [01:38:34.920 --> 01:38:43.160] if the court will allow it I have it backed up on a recorder see if they want to go there [01:38:43.160 --> 01:38:50.200] one of my favorite questions in court was how do you know that's exactly what was said [01:38:50.200 --> 01:38:58.040] oh well I transcripted off the recording objection objection oh yeah you open the door that's [01:38:58.040 --> 01:39:02.840] right that's right that's all I wanted to add I'll get off the other guy that's waiting [01:39:02.840 --> 01:39:09.840] all right thank you Tony thanks Tony okay we're going now to Mark in Wisconsin hey Mark [01:39:09.840 --> 01:39:14.840] thanks for calling in what's your question or comment for our guest Mike oh I have a [01:39:14.840 --> 01:39:20.760] little story for Randy Randy always told us to go to the top don't talk to the the minions [01:39:20.760 --> 01:39:26.320] or the peons anyway my cable has been going down 40 50 times a day for the past month [01:39:26.320 --> 01:39:30.600] and the technicians just come over and tell me you know this is your fault this is this [01:39:30.600 --> 01:39:36.960] is your router or whatever and I knew it wasn't so I called him up and I told him I wanted [01:39:36.960 --> 01:39:43.480] to speak to the president and uh so so so I could send him a tort letter maybe that'll [01:39:43.480 --> 01:39:47.240] get somebody's attention over there and they said we can send a technician out I said no [01:39:47.240 --> 01:39:50.840] I don't want a technician you can talk to the manager no I don't want to talk to the [01:39:50.840 --> 01:39:55.440] manager I want to I want the president's name and they said well I'm sorry we don't have [01:39:55.440 --> 01:40:00.320] the president's name I said okay I'll look it up I'm done in Bradstreet thanks my wife [01:40:00.320 --> 01:40:08.480] wakes me up in the morning she says Mark there's a guy in the backyard with a ladder so they [01:40:08.480 --> 01:40:13.680] got it fixed the very next day before you know before I even woke up so I thought that [01:40:13.680 --> 01:40:21.440] was pretty cool Randy always says go to the top so that's what I did good work yeah yeah [01:40:21.440 --> 01:40:26.680] hey uh I was I wanted to call I sent out a letter of validation accidentally to an original [01:40:26.680 --> 01:40:32.280] creditor Mike yep they were they were listed as a servicer and I looked through my mortgage [01:40:32.280 --> 01:40:36.160] paperwork and it turns out that they're the original creditor even though they say that [01:40:36.160 --> 01:40:41.000] they're they're the servicer in my credit report so do I need to send them a new letter [01:40:41.000 --> 01:40:48.360] of investigation well it depends on what you're doing if it's you know under fair credit you [01:40:48.360 --> 01:40:53.640] can just send a dispute letter if they're in your credit report that's all that's required [01:40:53.640 --> 01:40:59.320] if you're getting into the mortgage foreclosure thing that kind of stuff qualified written [01:40:59.320 --> 01:41:06.120] request and I think Randy is the guy who could probably speak on that better than me oh yeah [01:41:06.120 --> 01:41:13.840] I just I just wanted to stack up some SCRA or SCRA violations until I get this this particular [01:41:13.840 --> 01:41:21.800] mortgage audited yeah yeah well then you can go after the servicer you know and and just [01:41:21.800 --> 01:41:27.120] dispute with the servicer you dispute the credit lines in the credit report period well [01:41:27.120 --> 01:41:32.120] turns out the people who say there's my servicer are actually the original or the OCs the original [01:41:32.120 --> 01:41:37.160] creditor so that's okay letter and tell them tell them I want an investigation instead [01:41:37.160 --> 01:41:43.900] of a validation uh no the number you play the better off you are you're just disputing [01:41:43.900 --> 01:41:48.400] it and they're required by law if you read the Fair Credit Reporting Act when you dispute [01:41:48.400 --> 01:41:52.720] an item they're required to mark the account and dispute and they're quite required to [01:41:52.720 --> 01:41:59.080] do an investigation okay so so uh they didn't mark it in dispute so I'm making three thousand [01:41:59.080 --> 01:42:05.540] dollars a month on them right yeah and if they didn't prove the account to you uh that's [01:42:05.540 --> 01:42:11.840] also another thousand dollars across each board no they didn't do that either well then [01:42:11.840 --> 01:42:18.960] they're reporting see they're reporting erroneous and inaccurate information because they didn't [01:42:18.960 --> 01:42:26.200] prove you out something so it's six thousand dollars for each month times every month they [01:42:26.200 --> 01:42:35.600] upgrade it yeah plus my wife yeah and so you're it's in both your reports right your [01:42:35.600 --> 01:42:42.000] wife's and yours everything just doubled everything just doubled oh good they didn't mark it in [01:42:42.000 --> 01:42:48.080] dispute either Mike yeah that's what I'm saying so you got six thousand of yours and six thousand [01:42:48.080 --> 01:42:54.720] in your wife's report that's twelve thousand dollars times every month they update it good [01:42:54.720 --> 01:42:59.680] good okay I need to give me some credit cards because that's more money than I make yeah [01:42:59.680 --> 01:43:08.240] and and well the point is uh you know they'll have the tendency to send you out a letter [01:43:08.240 --> 01:43:13.280] and say oh we need more information we need your your your social security we need the [01:43:13.280 --> 01:43:17.280] account number and all that and like I said earlier yeah you're in my credit report now [01:43:17.280 --> 01:43:21.360] you're trying to tell me you don't know who I am but you go in there and every month and [01:43:21.360 --> 01:43:25.920] badmouth me in my credit report you have no trouble doing that but you have trouble finding [01:43:25.920 --> 01:43:33.600] my account so this leads to another issue they do not have the systems in place to prevent [01:43:33.600 --> 01:43:38.880] error if you read the fair credit reporting act it says they must have the systems to [01:43:38.880 --> 01:43:43.840] prevent error so if I get a letter like that from him I just put that on the side and when [01:43:43.840 --> 01:43:49.320] I write up my complaint I mention the date of the letter he's asking me for more information [01:43:49.320 --> 01:43:53.280] and they're in my credit report but they claim they don't know who I am they must not have [01:43:53.280 --> 01:43:57.440] the systems in place to prevent error yeah we'll be right back mark hang on the line [01:44:06.080 --> 01:44:13.280] aerial spring chemtrails the modified atmosphere heavy metals and pesticides [01:44:13.280 --> 01:44:19.680] carcinogens and chemical fibers all falling from the sky you have a choice to keep your [01:44:19.680 --> 01:44:31.840] body clean detoxify with micro plant powder from hemp usa.org or call 908-691-2608 it's odorless [01:44:31.840 --> 01:44:38.560] and tasteless and used in any liquid or food protect your family now with micro plant powder [01:44:39.280 --> 01:44:46.560] cleaning out heavy metals parasites and toxins water it now for daily intake and stock it now [01:44:46.560 --> 01:44:54.800] for long-term storage visit hemp usa.org or call 908-691-2608 today [01:45:16.560 --> 01:45:29.120] all right we're here with michael meris we're speaking with mark from wisconsin callers if [01:45:29.120 --> 01:45:39.040] you like to call in 512-646-1984 okay we've got mark on the line all right so go ahead mike you [01:45:39.040 --> 01:45:45.840] were speaking about that they have to have proper systems in place to prevent error correct that [01:45:45.840 --> 01:45:51.440] the law you read the fair credit reporting act they must have systems in place to prevent error [01:45:52.320 --> 01:45:59.200] and you know when you they send you notice and say we need your social security number we need [01:45:59.200 --> 01:46:04.720] the account number what you must not have the systems in place to prevent error so just add [01:46:04.720 --> 01:46:12.080] that to the complaint as well another violation so i mean you know and and the point is when these [01:46:12.080 --> 01:46:17.920] go into the courts and you start dealing with the attorneys you may get some resistance up front but [01:46:17.920 --> 01:46:23.200] after a while they go away they get it they understand why they're in there unfortunately [01:46:23.200 --> 01:46:28.160] they don't teach consumer law in the law schools there's about 12 schools around the united states [01:46:28.160 --> 01:46:37.520] that teach it and it's optional it's optional consumer law oh we have our group here and and [01:46:37.520 --> 01:46:43.200] we're pretty educated in consumer law uh i've been up against a number of attorneys and i've [01:46:43.200 --> 01:46:47.040] had other people that have been up against a number of attorneys and we wind up educating them [01:46:49.440 --> 01:46:54.080] then the lights come on and they look like the proverbial gear in the headlight it's like oh [01:46:54.080 --> 01:46:58.960] yeah okay now we understand where you're coming from uh yeah your your client broke the law and [01:46:58.960 --> 01:47:07.440] i caught him what do you want to do about it it's that simple right hey mike i sent a letter to [01:47:07.440 --> 01:47:13.520] uh uh to the uh credit youth or the credit reporting agency told them i disputed everything [01:47:13.520 --> 01:47:20.320] on my credit report and they said i have to send back an itemized list yeah yeah you you know you [01:47:20.320 --> 01:47:27.840] got to realize who you're dealing with okay and you do have to you know put the line item name in [01:47:27.840 --> 01:47:36.160] abc bank cbs bank mbc bank xyz bank i disputed i disputed i disputed you got to hold them by the [01:47:36.160 --> 01:47:42.960] hand almost but and then see and that and then that gets them out of you know saying uh well we [01:47:42.960 --> 01:47:49.120] can't do an investigation because you weren't specific and i kind of agree with that to a degree [01:47:49.840 --> 01:47:58.000] but the point is uh when you do this you do this in a timing type of thing when you dispute with [01:47:58.000 --> 01:48:03.520] the creditor you wait for the creditor get their letter and then you dispute with the bureau after [01:48:03.520 --> 01:48:07.680] the creditor gets their letter and you send everything certified mail so you can see when [01:48:07.680 --> 01:48:14.880] the creditor gets their letter and then you turn the bureau on for the investigation right after [01:48:14.880 --> 01:48:19.440] the creditor so that they're doing the both doing the investigation at the same time and you want [01:48:19.440 --> 01:48:25.040] the bureau to come back and say geez we investigated this and we're reporting it correctly [01:48:25.840 --> 01:48:30.480] that's what you want them to say right because that means the creditor has not marked the [01:48:30.480 --> 01:48:38.480] accounting dispute and the bureau just confirmed it right okay have you heard of bay area credit [01:48:38.480 --> 01:48:46.240] mike have i ever heard of them yeah the name sounds familiar bay area credit sounds familiar [01:48:46.240 --> 01:48:52.400] i probably have well that's their third party bill collectors i got about six thousand violations [01:48:52.400 --> 01:48:56.000] out of my sent them a tort letter i've been playing phone tag with them i finally get a hold [01:48:56.000 --> 01:49:04.880] of the lady and she says we sent you a notice of validation i said no you didn't she said yes we [01:49:04.880 --> 01:49:12.560] did i said prove it so she goes on to the next thing she says we didn't give you any false or [01:49:12.560 --> 01:49:18.080] misleading information i said yes you did i got it documented documented and she goes we gave you [01:49:18.080 --> 01:49:24.640] the mini miranda every time we called i said no you didn't she goes we recorded the calls we gave [01:49:24.640 --> 01:49:30.000] you the mini miranda every time every time we called you and i said i recorded it too i'd like [01:49:30.000 --> 01:49:35.840] to hear your recording and she just hung up on me yeah yeah yeah i think she just figured out i was [01:49:35.840 --> 01:49:42.960] recording her too and she just lied to me three or four times in a row yeah yeah yeah well you [01:49:42.960 --> 01:49:48.560] know who you're dealing with and and just like people say to me when they're doing this hey we [01:49:48.560 --> 01:49:54.000] got a letter back from the creditor and they put some statements in the envelope to prove that i [01:49:54.000 --> 01:50:03.040] said you did well i said let me ask you something did they come certified mail and you signed for [01:50:03.040 --> 01:50:09.200] um no oh i said i know what it is they sent fedex didn't they and you had a sign for [01:50:10.000 --> 01:50:17.040] no oh ups no no so i'm going to ask you one simple question what did they send you [01:50:17.040 --> 01:50:22.240] exactly prove it you know i thought enough of the law to send everything to you certified mail [01:50:23.200 --> 01:50:29.200] but because i'm just a lonely no nothing consumer you wouldn't take that course of action would you [01:50:29.200 --> 01:50:36.000] so you could save four dollars and fifty cents okay so that tells you what they think of a law [01:50:36.000 --> 01:50:37.520] they could care less [01:50:37.520 --> 01:50:43.600] right i'm filing on them on monday um hey i made a big mistake i wondered what you what you think [01:50:43.600 --> 01:50:48.400] i should do about it i had uh i called up a creditor my wife said call this number this guy called [01:50:48.400 --> 01:50:56.400] he wants to talk to you and uh it's it's over a car paying a car uh loan and one of my cars got [01:50:56.400 --> 01:51:01.440] totaled in a flood and i'm in litigation trying to get my money back and i'm trying to get my [01:51:01.440 --> 01:51:08.240] loan one of my cars got totaled in a flood and i'm in litigation trying to get my money from uh the [01:51:08.240 --> 01:51:13.120] gap insurance company and i told him it was my account and everything and and you know i know i [01:51:13.120 --> 01:51:18.640] shouldn't have done that i screwed up i know uh but he said that he had my credit credit report [01:51:18.640 --> 01:51:23.280] right there in front of me in front of him and he didn't read me the mini miranda should should [01:51:23.280 --> 01:51:29.040] i attack him or should i just send him wait a minute whoa whoa whoa the debt collector had your [01:51:29.040 --> 01:51:37.360] credit report in front of you yeah really yeah you read it off to me isn't that a felony well [01:51:37.360 --> 01:51:43.760] it could be no it's one year violation yeah what's one year in jail permissible purpose [01:51:43.760 --> 01:51:48.240] to pull the report he's going to say well we're collecting a debt well did you ever prove the debt [01:51:50.400 --> 01:51:56.400] when i challenged you you know when you contact me you know i sent you a validation letter and [01:51:56.400 --> 01:51:59.520] you never proved it that to me so what's your permissible purpose [01:52:02.160 --> 01:52:05.680] to pull the credit report he had this before i even talked to him [01:52:08.640 --> 01:52:12.560] huh that's interesting well yeah they can do that yeah they can do that [01:52:14.560 --> 01:52:17.760] but your answer is is what is your permissible purpose to do that [01:52:17.760 --> 01:52:24.240] all right well i'm going to send him validation and verification and see where it goes so that [01:52:24.240 --> 01:52:30.240] that's not a violation for him to have the credit report well you know here's here's the issue [01:52:30.240 --> 01:52:36.240] okay they have to prove to you that they're collecting something and if they don't prove [01:52:36.240 --> 01:52:43.680] that then i think title 18 kicks in and title 18 is because you pulled that credit report it's a [01:52:43.680 --> 01:52:50.000] felony invasion of privacy and it's punishable by up to i believe it's two years in prison and [01:52:50.000 --> 01:52:55.600] it's a felony i was going to say how do they have authority to pull your credit report and [01:52:55.600 --> 01:53:00.320] unless you gave it to them i mean generally we're collecting a debt that's their answer [01:53:00.320 --> 01:53:04.560] but is that legitimate authority to pull someone's credit report [01:53:04.560 --> 01:53:10.560] it is unless you know how to fight it you don't know what to do [01:53:10.560 --> 01:53:16.480] fight it you don't know what to do they can do what they want well what i'm saying is [01:53:17.520 --> 01:53:24.080] generally i thought you had to sign off in order for somebody to be able to pull your credit report [01:53:24.080 --> 01:53:30.880] well i understand what you're saying i uh i had uh a fairly large debt collector in federal court [01:53:30.880 --> 01:53:38.240] a while back a couple of years now and uh they did that with me over 500 alleged account [01:53:38.240 --> 01:53:44.000] i valid i sent them a validation letter they never validated they were in my credit report [01:53:45.840 --> 01:53:50.960] and i went after them and when i sent them notice of pending lawsuit their corporate attorney called [01:53:50.960 --> 01:53:55.680] me what's this all about and i told them i said you know you got 10 days and well give me a little [01:53:55.680 --> 01:54:00.400] more time and i'll see what we can work out i said okay so i gave an extra five days he didn't respond [01:54:00.400 --> 01:54:06.960] it and i filed the tuesday before the monday they had to respond to the complaint he was on the [01:54:06.960 --> 01:54:11.600] phone to me uh i talked to a couple weeks ago i remember now we've been served with the complaint [01:54:11.600 --> 01:54:18.880] like to work something out and i i recorded the conversation at first i will not play that here [01:54:18.880 --> 01:54:25.680] but i do have the conversation and we got into it about this exact topic and my question is what is [01:54:25.680 --> 01:54:32.240] your permissible purpose to pull my credit report well sir we're collecting a debt i says uh well i [01:54:32.240 --> 01:54:36.800] understand that but what is your permissible purpose he says to me are you telling me i i can't [01:54:36.800 --> 01:54:41.360] pull your credit report i says sir you can do whatever you want but what is your permissible [01:54:41.360 --> 01:54:49.920] purpose well we were trying to collect this debt for 500 i says what debt sir he says this this [01:54:49.920 --> 01:54:56.000] x credit card you had was 500 balance on it but and i'm going to i said to him one more time sir [01:54:56.000 --> 01:55:03.600] what debt he says i i don't follow you i says last november i sent you a letter of validation [01:55:03.600 --> 01:55:10.640] asking to prove that i had some type of account or debt with you and you never responded to that [01:55:10.640 --> 01:55:14.400] so i'm going to ask you one more time what debt are you talking about [01:55:16.880 --> 01:55:22.720] and he got real quiet he says well he says i guess uh i guess if we went into court we'd make some [01:55:22.720 --> 01:55:28.000] case law and i thought to myself oh brother there's enough of it already on the books [01:55:28.000 --> 01:55:33.360] okay but they can do whatever they want and the only one is going to stop them is you [01:55:35.840 --> 01:55:41.760] well mike is it unlawful for them to pull your credit report unless you sign off of them or [01:55:42.400 --> 01:55:48.240] for it or not they have not if they're affiliated with the creditor they're claiming they bought it [01:55:48.240 --> 01:55:53.520] from the creditor we know that that's you know they're not okay but the point is that they [01:55:53.520 --> 01:55:59.600] pulled the report so what is your recourse your recourse is to go after them and file charges [01:55:59.600 --> 01:56:04.960] against them for doing that you're right they don't have a right to pull it okay unless you [01:56:04.960 --> 01:56:10.240] have some type of contract with them like you do with a creditor who can arbitrarily pull your [01:56:10.240 --> 01:56:16.960] report at any time if you have a credit card or note or anything like that it's in their agreements [01:56:16.960 --> 01:56:23.280] they can pull your credit report to review your credit anytime but once it goes to a third party [01:56:23.280 --> 01:56:28.640] to me it becomes questionable but they will do what they want because they know nobody's going [01:56:28.640 --> 01:56:34.320] to come after him for this stuff let me get this straight mike i think under the law only the [01:56:34.320 --> 01:56:41.760] original creditor insurance companies and anyone you sign and say that they can pull your credit [01:56:41.760 --> 01:56:47.440] report are the only people who can pull it on their you know legally right that's what that's correct [01:56:47.440 --> 01:56:54.000] that's correct that's correct absolutely correct that's what i thought so what so there is no [01:56:54.000 --> 01:56:58.720] authority for these third-party debt collectors to pull your credit report then oh and but the [01:56:58.720 --> 01:57:10.000] point is what are you going to do about it right well there you go and they'll keep on do you [01:57:10.000 --> 01:57:15.520] are you really think they're afraid of you that they're not afraid of you until you get them in [01:57:15.520 --> 01:57:23.840] that federal courtroom that's where the ground gets kind of leveled at that point you know [01:57:25.040 --> 01:57:28.080] so did i did i screw that up by admitting to the debt mike [01:57:30.640 --> 01:57:39.120] uh you know i i i wouldn't even hesitate to worry about that because again here's [01:57:39.120 --> 01:57:44.800] here's my standard answer let's let the judge and jury determine who's right and who's wrong [01:57:44.800 --> 01:57:46.560] that's why we have judges and juries [01:57:49.760 --> 01:57:56.400] let them sort it out see if they want to go there okay i can almost guarantee you that the cost of [01:57:56.400 --> 01:58:01.440] defending on one of these cases they're they're going to get religion pretty quick [01:58:01.440 --> 01:58:12.960] uh okay mark do you have anything else yeah another quick question okay all right stay on [01:58:12.960 --> 01:58:21.600] the line we also have fred in colorado and fred has purchased your course mike so we're going [01:58:21.600 --> 01:58:32.080] to go to fred after mark so fred stay on the line you're next okay all right we will be right back [01:58:51.600 --> 01:59:06.080] my name is randall kelton and i co-host on rule of law radio we specialize in showing people how [01:59:06.080 --> 01:59:11.440] to strike back against corrupt public officials with the mortgage crisis worsening we set our [01:59:11.440 --> 01:59:16.640] sights on finding a remedy for people who have been cheated by their lenders if you have a mortgage [01:59:16.640 --> 01:59:22.000] or have paid yours off you have probably been cheated out of thousands but there is a remedy [01:59:22.000 --> 01:59:31.360] go to remedies in real estate dot com or call me at 512-430-4140 and find out how to use the [01:59:31.360 --> 01:59:36.800] consumer protection laws to recover what the lenders have stolen through fraud and deception [01:59:36.800 --> 01:59:41.920] we will prepare for you a qualified written request that will expose the fraud and put the [01:59:41.920 --> 01:59:48.160] lenders on the dime lender fraud is bankrupting this country and it's time to fight back go to [01:59:48.160 --> 01:59:57.760] remedies in real estate dot com or call 512-430-4140 and get the information you need to stop the money [01:59:57.760 --> 02:00:12.800] changers in their tracks